It’s not hard to understand. Normal steering is easy steering, simple as that. You can’t justify using it by saying “oh, but sim is designed specifically for wheels”, firstly because it isn’t, and secondly because it doesn’t matter what it was designed for. Sim steering is perfectly controllable on a pad; I know because I always use it.
If you can’t control sim steering, it means you aren’t good at throttle and steering control and you need to practice more. Normal steering makes the driving far easier than most people realize, to the point where I’d even call it an actual assist.
The reason controller is used in the ForzaRC is to create that idea that “hey, everyone can eventually reach this level”, as the controller is only above the keyboard when it comes to steering input in racing games. Ironic as it might be, it also levels all of the competitors. Forza licenses its brand to wheel manufacturers (Fanatec), but I shouldn’t be forced to practice with Fanatec products, and the wheel you use does make a difference in feel, as would any other input method.
Normal steering is heavily dampened compared to Sim. As Cervy put it, in theory it’s not made for wheels. But all of the competitive events in Forza allow both, so I default to Normal because it gives you much more control over the car. With Simulation you have to unlearn the type of countersteering you do with Normal. It becomes a fair bit closer to other games. Simulation steering requires specific tunes as well, as you don’t have to force better turn-in with better dampening. In fact, it demands the opposite, that the car be made more forgiving instead.
As for Forza’s eligibility as a legitimate esports title, I wouldn’t say that bringing in more PC players, as DUST2DEATH said, is an absolute necessity. Forza was born on the Xbox and it has its biggest following on the Xbox. Excluding Apex, FM7 was the first fully-fledged Forza Motorsport title available on PC, and Turn 10 is gonna have a hard time swaying the type of people who take part in iRacing into playing Forza instead. It’s a different situation from Rainbow Six, which to my knowledge has been multiplatform for a really long time. Forza’s stand on esports is more akin to Halo, which is also a franchise born and raised on consoles.
I agree.
That Vegas eRace was not very impressive from what I’ve heard though. PC only sims don’t appear to be doing well for eSports. A multiplatform or 1st party racing game seems to be the only way to go for now if you ask me.
Maybe not an “absolute necessity”, but it should help out a lot. Turn 10 don’t need to take iRacing’s audience, there’s plenty of people on PC that would be interested in a game like Forza.
Make the prize big enough and it doesnt matter, those who feel as though they are skilled enough will come to whatever game or console. Think about the mclaren challenge that happened not to long ago, the competition was on pc, xbox, ps4, and mobile and brought out all sorts of people playing every different thing to try and get the chance at being an official sim tester for mclaren.
Bringing in more PC players?
Currently is none, zero, because PC isnt allowed in RC, and most users on PC will have a wheel.
Its a net positive to forza, and the player pool no matter what.
That’s not the issue.
if sim steering is true physics then a wheel user should be able to drive the cars very comfortably, just as comfortably as a gamepad user on normal but only if the FFB is up to the task.
What Aaron mensioned here is not possible on sim steering (and even on normal its doest feel natural) and like I said if sim is true physics then there is something terribly wrong, you just can’t trust the wheel to do what it’s supposed to like you can in the video I posted above. Even when doing rediculous thing with the tuning of the car you can’t get close to it, then on the flip side if you use normal steering you can’t throw the car around aggressively because it is restricted.
I died. Crying.
No one is going to take you seriously like this, even with money.
Meanwhile in upside down aus. V8’s werent having none of that bs^^^
It’s embarrassing honestly…
+10 ²³ …
I love when a noob brings this up makes me laugh everytime.
Simulation steering is a completely unassisted steering basically normal steering is a dumbed out version of sim steering for noobs who cant do smooth imputs.
Simulation steering is not for wheels like all the noobs say its just to hard for them to learn the hard way like 99% in this game otherwise there would be no option in the game to use on a controller.
And also its possible to drift with simulation steering on controller too its just really hard and you actually need actual skill to do it unlike normal steering.
I will admit i dont use a wheel in forza so i can’t tell you if its harder then controller id be bsing if i did.
Lies, simulation is broken.
The ridiculous snap oversteer that results in the use of simulation, is hardly realistic at all.
Just because you may be able to make small enough inputs using a controller to make it work, doesn’t make it good or realistic, or other people complaining about it bad at the game.
You shouldn’t need to learn how to make inputs on a driving game to make it work.
Hook it in, opposite lock it & play with the throttle, it’s not hard.
Yet if you try that on simulation, it’ll send you into orbit.
The variance between different cars is ridiculous too, i managed to use simulation, using the wheel for a few races, including using the 70’s F1 cars, they were actually heaps of fun to drive, but then i got onto using the GT2 RS, couldn’t control it. Now tell me that this is actually an accurate representation of real life. lol
If a GT2 RS handled anything like simulation mode in real life, there wouldn’t be any left.
I was googling steering wheel settings, trying different set ups.
I was adjusting the car, trying to make transfers less aggressive, trying to make it understeer, nothing was working.
It didn’t matter if i had the DOR on 500°, or 900°, it only had approximately 30° in either way.
If it started to step out at all in a corner, you basically had to hold the gas steady & hold the wheel near dead centre, only turning slightly into the corner & trying to 4 wheel slide it into the corner, any opposite lock, especially past 10° & you were a goner.
I finally cracked it & switched it over to Normal, for Normal people. lol
It was like a different game, the car felt awesome, actually, the car was now too understeery, but controllable.
I came too hot into the last chicane on Suzuka, clutch + quick stab on the hand brake, opposite lock, slid through the left turn in 2nd, on the transition, changed to 3rd & held it pegged round onto the straight, like a dream, no unrealistic, instantaneous direction changes.
Sim steering definitely isn’t unfiltered, it actually seems to add a filter compared to normal, and it’s that added filter that causes this problem. If you drive with cockpit view, you can see what is happening, the driver applies opposite lock without the user providing that input, and it’s that steering input, provided as a filter rather than by the user, which causes the car to violently overcorrect. That automatic violent overcorrection doesn’t happen with normal steering.
Say what? That’s very farfetched. Simulation steering removes countersteering assistance when using a gamepad, on a wheel there is no assistance for countersteering because you have much finer control AND FFB to help you instead. The other thing that is removed on both controller and wheel is the weight tranfer/angular momentum damper that is present on normal steering.
IMHO Standard FFB on a wheel is one of the main reasons that makes oversteer difficult on sim steering, with custom FFB, sim steering feels very very good.
Can I reclaim the RWD World Record? - drifting with 900 Degrees and Simulation steering, there are a few videos on my chanel showing how much easier it is to oversteer on sim steering on a wheel with custom made FFB.
What do you mean custom FFB?
thanks to data out and EmuWheel on PC, we were able to make custom calculations (based on pacekja formulas) to make brand new FFB.
So you had to mod it to do that?
You’ve modded the game to make it easier & are holding records with your decreased difficulty.
No wonder i was reading posts some where in here about Forza comps being for consoles with controllers only.
So back to the original topic… Forza Motorsport’s “Simulation” setting is broken.
No and no, the game has not been altered in anyway shape or form as Ialyrn said, and you missed the point completely. With better FFB simulation steering feels awesome, and most definatley is not broken.
They have not modded the game, they are using the data out system that T10 themselves added to the windows 10 version of FM7; and using a 3rd party program to calculate new force feedback based entirely upon upon the information that the game itself sends out. Realistically, the person who has done this needs to be hired by T10; as they have a far greater handle on how to build a force feedback system than. But as is clear to see, there is no trickery or “modding” going on. And the game itself is not altered.
Does it really matter on a pad when the tuning parameters are as open and unrealistic as they are anyways. You can tune every car to feel exactly the same and how you want anyways so if the cars too hard to drive you just need to adjust the tune. Doesnt make the driver more skilled makes the tune more suitable…