Inputs - Shifting Lag on Manual With Clutch (1633642)

unnable to engage clutch correctly I Use the same setup I have in the past ( Elite controller with rear paddel setup ) and I am unnable to switch gear correctly

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When using the Manual With Clutch shifting method (even on pedals with an H-Pattern), there is some fixed amount of time that the clutch is engaged in game. If you’re faster than that fixed amount of time, you’re automatically losing time.

Also, a problem that is carried over from FM7 is that the game cannot identify the difference between a sequential shifter versus an H-Pattern. If you’re on Manual With Clutch, you always need to use a clutch to shift (even if you move to something like an F1 car). It’s insane that Assetto Corsa had this figured out in 2014, but 9 years later, Forza Motorsport can’t do it.

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One trick to get around the lag is to keybind your clutch to a button yea its weird but it will engage and disengage way faster although i used this method on other games and yet to try it on FM8

That worked on previous games, where you’d map clutch to A, shift up to X, and shift down to B, so you could just smash two buttons at once for a fast shift.

With this new game, even if you can shift with a clutch in say 0.3 seconds, there is a fixed clutch engagement timer in ever shift of something like 1 second. So the advantage you’d gain from actually knowing how to shift quickly on pedals and a physical shifter, is eliminated. And it throws off the balance of your car.

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Wow thats so trash. Theres so many things that just dont make sense like this new car leveling system is cool but for experience players it’s really annoying as u unlock things in a way that you don’t really wanna utilize idk just FM8 seems a bit ehh compared to fm7 even with the issues of fm7 i think i rather stay there till they figure it out

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Definitely don’t waste your money on the new game.

This game is still far behind Assetto Corsa, and that released in 2014.

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For those that dont know, this was their solution for “power shifting”… you need to depress accelerator, full press clutch, shift, fully depress clutch and then you can accelerate again, otherwise if you’re too fast it will stay in neutral for 1-2 seconds before shifting.

This is an issue even on paddle shift cars, because for some reason, street cars with paddle shifting need a clutch pressed to shift gears, because no one at T10 never drove a car with paddle shifts.
Also, you can listen how bad it is when the cinematic with the car leaving the pits/joining track, you can hear the rev to the max and then shift… in the cinematic

I also think it affects car launches with a wheel, using same care, same setting, same track/conditions, if i floor the acceleration at the start of the race…
*With controller it launches as it should you lift off a bit then shift, and keeps momentum and can keep up with the ret of the car
*With a wheel and manual shifting (without clutch), the car barely moves while revving to the max and when it finally decides to move, it barely move, get passed by 3-4 cars (no wheel spin)

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This is broken. I have a 2001 A4 with a manual transmission, and even while trying to drive smooth I typically shift faster than is possible in game (using the 2004 S4 for as fair a comparison as possible).
In game I use a setup with a H-patten shifter and pedals with a clutch pedal.

This really appears to be a bug. The delay that appears to have been implemented to combat issues with the manual/w clutch setting for controllers is breaking wheel setups. When I shift using the wheel, the game adds the delay to stop controller abuse onto the real delay of depressing the clutch pedal (and again when moving the physical shifter). This completely scrambles the timing making it completely unnatural and unrealistic.

Please find some way of separating controller users from wheel + pedals users.

Part of the reason I skipped several Forza versions was due to an issue with FM4 where the smoother input from 900 degree wheels was falsely flagged as cheating (using recorded inputs). I am not pleased to see another issue where people who have spent money to get a good setup are carelessly thrown under the bus again.

Edit: Spelling

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I’ve had issue with FM7 giving horrible noises and transmission damage from shifting with clutch. I thought it was an issue with clutch engagement but having experienced it on the new FM I now realise it is when you move the shifter too quickly, not related to the clutch pedal at all.

Somewhat confident it’s not a bug per se carried over from the old game, but certainly something only Forza has issues with as other games work fine

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I am having this exact same experience with the wheel and h-pattern…very annoying, slows you down and can upset the car’s balance. This should not be an issue in 2023…never an issue in AC and Project Cars

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It is possible that the delay is only on the shifting part, but with an H-pattern shifter, there is a delay as I move it between gears. Getting that delay amplified by an extra delay started when the new gear is selected (which does appear to register as a button), would still create an unnatural timing.

I suspect there is a delay in the clutch too because there are also problems with standing starts (where the car is already “in” the right gear). In game, I can’t even perform the slow careful start that you would make with a police officer watching closely.

Bug or poor design, it needs fixing.

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I don’t know if it’s the same problem, but it doesn’t just slow you down.

On controller with damage enabled it is almost impossible to downshift reasonably quickly without destroying the gearbox, which in turn worsens the problem.

I’m driving with clutch since FM3 and never had issues like this. I’m not depressing both buttons at the same time, but if the timing is just fractions of a second off, the gearbox is damaged.

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Have the same issue and to add to this, the rolling starts are bugged so you cant just start by pressing the gas or it will act like a missed shift. The only way to get around this is to start with the clutch pressed in while in the correct gear, which gives you a disadvantage on race start.

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I’m glad to hear it’s not only me having clutch problems. I’ve driven with manual and clutch the past few games with no problems. No matter what you do you’re either way slower than in manual mode or you damage your transmission. It feels like you have to hold the clutch for a whole second during the shift. It makes Rev matching near impossible. I drove with the damage display on trying to figure out how to shift in manual without damaging the transmission. Guess I’ll be playing in manual mode only from now on.

I know they were trying to get around people mashing the clutch and shift buttons with no throttle lift. But this new system just doesn’t work.

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There may be two (or three) things going on here.

When I was trying to adjust button assignments yesterday, it kept on instantly assigning every command to the same button. Once I placed the H-pattern shifter into neutral (from 4th), I could properly reassign buttons. I may be mistaken but it appears that once you shift, the game then ads a shifting delay (that the developers felt appropriate for that level of transmission) to simulate the time it would take to actually move the gearshift. The problem is, if you are using an H-pattern shifter, you have already completed that action. So physically the shift is complete, and it is time to release the clutch pedal, but the game is just starting the shifting action. This creates an unnatural timing for the shift. H-pattern shifters need to be treated differently. Either ignore the gear selection delay, or grade the quality of the shift, and then delay the results as appropriate. That or improve support for H-pattern shifters so they appear as something more than button presses to the game.

As for starts:

  1. I have yet to find a way to get a good standing start, or even start from stopped without causing the engine to bog down. I am starting to believe that this is a separate issue from the shifting delay. Probably again due to differences between pedals and controllers.

  2. As for rolling starts, it is undeniably a bug. Before release the car is in the correct gear clutch engaged, with the gas applied (slightly). Pressing the gas pedal to full should cause no issues at all (outside of loss of traction). Instead, it appears to start with the clutch disengaged, so any throttle triggers an overrev, and then a bad shift as the clutch is engaged while under power. The only way to safely preform a rolling start is to treat it like a standing start (but off the gas). Otherwise, you get a free 1% transmission damage which makes the shift timing even less predictable and begins a vicious cycle of transmission and engine damage from “bad” shifts.

At least the gear number is large enough to see, but I really hate being forced to watch it (and learn bad shift timing)

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There’s an issue with launches at start between wheel and controller too.
ABS ON, TC/SC Off, Sim Steering, Manual without clutch. On controller full throttle car launches as it should, spins a bit, revs go down as it starts to get grip and gets going. Same thing with a wheel, full throttle, car spins wheels and just bogs down, get passed by everyone as the car wont move as fast as it should, with pedal to the floor

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Ya same here man it just messes the whole driving experience up throwing ruining the transmission or messing up weight transformation mid turn, it feels weird to rev match when down shifting as well as trying to shift mid turn it just throws everything off. I don’t like it and hopefully they change it for all of us!

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I am going to have to turn damage off until this issue is addressed. “Miss” one shift due to the artificial (and unnatural, clutch ruining) delay, and the damage rapidly compounds as the shift delay gets even more problematic.

The transmission seems much more sensitive to damage than anything else on the car making things even worse. I used to dread the AI looking at my fenders, now I can push them off the track without damage. The transmission seems to be made of eggshells.

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Is there any reason why the developers seem to think it’s cool to have a “pause” or “hiccup” between gear shifts on flappy paddle gearboxes?

Cars with dual clutch flappy paddle gearboxes should not have a pause, gap or hiccup between shifts. It should be seamless and uninterrupted between shifts. It’s not a manual stick shift!

Disappointed…

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