Hi,
I had the same problem, but in project cars.
Workaround: change USB port on Xbox or avoid any hub if used
Solution: check and replace if possible the last bit of cable on the TX (the din-USB). This is the responsible for the disconnecting problems.
You guys. It’s not a problem with the game. The game sees you using a controller for your profile. Go to the Xbox dashboard using your wheel. Click your profile at the top. Click “choose this person”.
So…
Last night I spent three and a half hours in my Spec Ford GT League (S Class), and played all but one race… I left to check the leader board… That is another issue altogether, but it sure would be nice to be able to view the leaderboard from within the lobby between races or as part of the race results tab…
Anyway, I wanted to add to my previous post about “My impression” regarding Wheel controllers seemingly being disadvantaged compared to handheld controllers…
What I found last night went like this…
First race… Brands Hatch in the rain of course… I performed like garbage and went on ranting to myself about wheel problems…. curse curse , Moan Moan!
Then onto Sonoma Midday Sunny which I love and have driven quite a bit in other cars, so I know the track pretty well. Still some problems but better! Spun due to poor choice overdriving turn 2 when feeling pressure from trailing driver… “He IS NOT getting MY position”… Well he did and so did the next three drivers… Repeat similar incidents on 3 and 3A or through 8a into the bus top (really caused by overdriving 8), and this race ended badly as well…
Still, having planned to put a concerted effort into learning limit control with my TX wheel, I was (when not succumbing to pressure) trying to be more technique conscious rather than finishing position conscious… (Never last long for most racers)
Eventually after many races, I started to feel much more comfortable with the FORCE (grip/tire feel) feedback as well as VIBRATION (info like wheel-spin, hop, being on rumble strips, grass, puddles, etc).
Dare I say, I began to “like” it again, and that I felt a great appreciation for what “WAS RIGHT” about the TX Wheel’s performance and the obvious physics at play in the game?
I began to LIKE is again, and felt a great appreciation for what WAS RIGHT about the TX Wheel’s performance and the obvious physics at play in the game!
There… I said it! Out loud and on the record!!! (again) (Jimmy -two-times… “get the papers”, ”get the papers”)
But I digress… LOL!
Anyway, I even began to greatly enjoy driving the Default Spec Ford GT — which was a bit challenging because the league was set to force defaults on everything, including tire pressure… which meant after half a lap at any more technical track, and all four tires were showing 35-37+ PSI… Lending to the Ice Skate feel. However, I quickly found that proper technique (Early braking, roll in, then fluid accel off) still made this very manageable… And everyone had the same hand dealt to them as well…
As I continues to reel myself into control and discipline, I found that I also began to easily interpret the FORCE feedback through the feel of the wheel (Ears for tire sound were important too). I could definitely tell by force pressure and slight vibe of slipping tires that I was at the edge of either the speed/acceleration limit, or the steering input limit for the section (closely linked to speed). I absolutely could feel when the front tires would break over to PUSH/SLIP when I had entered too quickly and/or was asking more from the steering angle I was trying to force by turning the wheel further than the grip would allow… Also, once I LEARNED the feel… I could easily feather throttle and EQUALLY IMPORTANT… feather the steering input, and front grip came right back!
That last sentence is TREMENDOUSL IMPORTANT…
Because…
That is exactly how a real car on real payment pushed “Just Slightly Past” its LIMIT will respond when over-reaching inputs (gas, brake, steering) are (and I stress) “Gently” and/or “Slightly” feathered!!!
Oh, and BTW No car will ever recover from being pushed WAY over it’s limits…
Think about it. Any HUGE deviation beyond the limits of the car’s capabilities will require HUGE corrective actions and in a Hugely fast manner (I made up the word for affect).
Huge actions done tremendously quickly are very very very unsettling to any car even with the best equipment and Tunes! There is a lesson here that I personally learned a lot about as I drove last night.
Going further into the description of my experience in “Learning the Limits and Feel”… If I did manage to brake perfectly entering, hit the apex (rolling through on the proper line), and start to accelerate off, the feel was “EQUALLY GOOD” as what I felt when entering at, near, or over the limits…
On exit, under power, The FORCE (Feedback, not Yoda) was still there, and the VIBRATION was too. The Vibration feedback was slightly different which was good, because front end PUSH, and back end slippage (due to wheel spin) should feel distinctly different… And they do! And once I found the feel I could distinguish the difference between the senses of the two, I started loving The Game and my TX even more
I still made a bunch of mistakes (“Damn I want to go faster” — even though slower controlled driving definitely proved faster), and never won a race (more on that in a bit), but what I want to stress here is the Following!
When I was able to control my urges to push way too hard, I could ABSOLUTELY find a balance with the wheel… Even with the S Class Spec Ford GT… and even in the rain.
By the end of the night, the only thing that was causing me to lose, was me! Maybe there is a couple things I’d like to see changed about the tire physics and FFB, but those (continue reading) were all sort of incidental and non-existent if I kept good technique and good track-lines.
NOW What Follows is a BIG, BIG statement from me considering my previous day’s post where I thought about Turn 10 giving to much preferential treatment for controller drivers…
Here it is:
When I started close to the front, kept my wits, discipline, and technique right, and drove the track rather than worrying about position… I RAN UP FRONT… with my TX Wheel… On a variety of tracks — Against obviously GOOD drivers — who were obviously using controllers!
I am sure too that my driving WAS DEFINITELY better with the Wheel than “MY” driving would have been had I used the controller…
AND…
THAT IS something I WOULD NOT have said prior to this late night’s — 3.5 hour exercise in improvement — first league play — out of my comfort zone— highly technical and wildly varied environments — all in the same SPEC Tuned car — in S-Class (where I KNOW I need skill refinement) — and with Wheel and Tire/Grip/FFB physics I had mildly complained about just yesterday!
IT WAS WICKED COOL!
Now, a couple of qualifiers…
The League I was in was a “No Contact” league… And I have not yet tried to race again in a multiplayer event where contact exists… I hope some of the things I’ve done to improve my driving style and hone my wheel settings (more later) will make that enjoyable too! “Incidental Contact” when on the edge of slipping out might be a whole other ball of wax… But even as I type, I think it probably will just require driving a still yet "further-held-back-from-the-limit” driving style in a given section of track so that a hit won’t send me way over said limits… and ending up skating off into an off track hell!
Also, in the league, I never actually won a single race… mostly (if not entirely) due to my own mistakes though.
And… I did use many assists that I would normally turn off in career play. For now I am comfortable with the decision to turn back on TC/SM and braking line… and even ABS… Doing so definitely got me to a place where I could “find the limits” without so many issues occurring at once, that would have caused the sensations (through feedback) to become too muddied to detect, comprehend, and learn… Later I will add them back in for the same car on some of the same tracks, and see if I get equally good results without them (future post). I did continue to use Manual with clutch though, as I personally think that good race driving requires them!
I will say that I do think there are some subtle fixes that Turn 10 Could/Should consider… But keep it on the track… know the limits… drive right… And “MY” TX Wheel Driving experience with Forza 6 is definitely getting more and more — well — Awesome! — “HNT Awesome” anyway, which may pale by comparison to others 
I really, REALLY hope this helps others! feel free to let me know (as I’m sure you will) if it does, or if I can clarify anything else… Also , If you are a Wheel Driver, feel free to add me to your friend list… I’m always looking to learn from, share, and drive with other wheel drivers…
I will post my TX wheel setup research and where I ended up. I looked at many posts that wildly varied and then I did a great deal of testing on my own too. I’ll share the results in another post.
Likewise, I will share the few nuisance issues I found with the FFB, and driving experience that can result from them… Most were off track issues Some will confirm what others have already alluded to… I will save that for another post though as well…
BTW—My kids gave me the name/gamer tag years ago… I’m definitely aware that I’m not really all that Awesome yet, but keep an eye in your rearview… I’m definitely coming!
Very interesting
@HNT Awesome, your post is awesome 
I only have ever played with wheel so I have had to do exactly what you did last night but I find I have to do it for every single track. Every new track I have to learn what kind of grip I can get from the corners (and it changes a lot from track to track). What the curbs will do and how far I can drop wheels. All this stuff on a track by track, turn by turn, basis and all because of how delicate the wheel forces you to be. I see the controller players figuring this out as well but being “off” on the controller doesn’t immediately send you into a wall. You can learn as you race. The first time I’m on a track I’m either a minute plus off the pace or I’m in the wall every other corner. It takes me a good 10 laps to really figure it out. But, like you found, just repeatedly driving over and over again you find where things feel good and you see the lap times drop and you become competitive. What I do find odd though is how little input the game is getting from the wheel. I have a race of 10 laps from Road America and when I replayed it with telemetry on it looks like I’m not steering at all. The steering telemetry looks completely flat. I think that is part of the problem. So little input goes in and too much just sends the car flying. 2 degrees to go around a 90 degree turn where 3 degrees of the wheel sends you into the wall? That’s just not true to life. Yes, I’ve learned this and I can make it around the corner. But it just seems like the game needs to relax a bit between steering input from the wheel and translating that into the turning of the cars wheel. As you stated, too much will send any car flying and I get that. But, watch the telemetry. It’s just not normal that so little input is actually turning the car.
Hey… and Thanks!
I see a lot of things to support what you are mentioning too… The reality of playing 3.5 hours of the league in a single Spec car means lots of laps on a set of tracks… I didn’t count exactly, but it was likely only six or eight, which amounted to a learning experience. When I talked about widely varied environments, I was eluding to the need to learn more! …and more specifically about tracks… precisely because — Like you Said — “it changes a lot from track to track.” which IS a good observation, and at the same time a testimonial into just how much Turn 10 has put into this version.
The tracks ARE very different… And like many have noticed, and I mentioned in an earlier post. I love the feel of every bump, crack, Payment patch, seam in the concrete, etc. And… that comes with a price when added to the physics of the game…
I don’t think FM5 took those things into account quite so much… FM6 IS better (more real) in this way… It will take some getting used to, but some of these things would upset a car on the edge in real life, and now the do in the game to…
So learning tracks now requires a new level of intimacy the FM5 (or other versions) simply didn’t seem to require.
I did spend some time “Spectating” the best performing drivers… I did so live and set up with a game camera from behind their car with telemetry up (fiddle with options and its pretty easy)… I too noticed just how little input was being applied to the steering! I originally wanted to look at the rate of application of braking pressure and throttle in and out of turns (which was helpful)… But I too was immediately surprised by the small amount of steering.
I think I was seeing more than 2-3%, but it wasn’t more than 30% (total deflection not steer angle) most of the time… You may want to consider tightening up your car a bit… I’d look at rear toe in maybe first…
Watching others through Spectate and viewing there telemetry was cool though…
One of the things I’ll talk about when I post about my wheel settings is that I settled on 360 DOR and Sensitivity of 2… For the S class Stock Spec Ford GT anyway… That may change with other cars and other classes though… Still that seemed to be a great balance for me…
I’m still looking into and reserving opinion on controllers having an advantage… After last night, I’m not totally convinced… I always attributed the difference to the immediacy that a handheld controller can effect steering corrections… Lock-Lock-Lock as needed in milliseconds… Which sort of gives them an artificial advantage… Particularly if you get into the grass (or worse… Soggy grass). Controllers don’t have steering FFB to fight… And one of the nuances I think might need addressed by Turn 10 is just how much that force seems to amplify in those off track situations… My wheel gets SOooooo Heavy… Often causing tank slapping… followed by spin… followed by struggle to get back onto driving surface… followed by becoming the caboose! LOL! Having done that several times, I am learning to avoid it at all costs…
Off track FFB seems too high to me… and like someone else said… I can at least partially confirm the tendancy for heavy leftward bias… particularly if off left side… i’m going play with this more this weekend though… Nothing to conclude yet!
Still, wheel driving is where it’s at for me… I want the realism Forza 6 seems to be presenting…
I’ll be racing later tonight… I’ll look you up. I don’t do voice though… Haven’t got the headset with TX working yet… Haven’t tried really!
Thanks again!
Thanks for taking the time to write this post. Now I have a request. Please look into the bug with the TX wheel in a multiplayer race with another controller turned on so I can chat without using the Kinect. What I find is that my wheel randomly will loose button config between races. I seems to have something to do with the second controller since this doesn’t happen when I’m not chatting online while using the racing wheel. All the sudden I will have my right paddle shifter change to my rearview button. Also there is a problem with the lobby AI not changing class when we change the class. That returned from FM5. Thanks I hope you guys can get this fixed.
hey there,
Another one to add to the list of bad force feedback.
I’ve been using various wheels since forza 2 so I’m no stranger to using a wheel as well as being part of the old school drift team of DUI.
Drifting is what I do most on forza and forza 2,3,4 I thought was good in terms of moving the wheel centre according to the caster from the front wheels. A little jerky compared to pc games but I could live with it. Christian as your the physics engineer you should of known that this is crucial to let wheel racers know what the back end is doing even when racing. Now when I’m in a slide there is nothing there apart from what I can describe is turning the wheel through syrup in both directions which then automatically makes it impossible to tell what angle the wheels are at in relation to the angle the cars sliding at.
Christian the last post you put up was to explain how the force feedback works. We just want to know is there gonna be a patch for people using the wheel.
Regards
Mark
I will Second Feedback from above as well regarding “turning the wheel through syrup”…
I don’t typically drift… however, as it stands right now, I am forced to be TOO Ginger, while accelerating off… Because, when I do overstep and break loose I have very little room for recovery…
When the slip is small, I can catch the step out very early and feather throttle and counter steer to save it… If however, I make a bigger mistake and the rear end steps out more significantly, then getting it back under control with the wheel seems foreign from previous game versions…
Reading DUI sx mad’s post made me realize what feels wrong about the slide recovery… The feedback presents itself sluggishly with regard to the tires finding their neutral position relative to the slide. And I’m pretty sure my repeated “overcorrection, tank slapping, spin outs, become race caboose” experiences would be improved by a better centering FFB in those situations.
Sometimes, I am also wondering if anyone has noticed any differences in this centering behavior with the different TX wheel sensitivities? Also, If anyone has tried changing the Wheel settings to use it’s centering settings instead of using the default “Allow game to control Centering”… I’ll probably play with this a bit tonight.
What scares me about the fun I am having with the wheel and game now though is that I am learning to deal with the “Syrup” feel when correcting after a tail slide (accidental drift). Particularly bad when off the track as well.
I’m afraid I’m creating a bad habit and learning bad form… just to cope!
Awesome, I used to drive the TX wheel in Forza 5 but I have upgraded to the Fanatec wheel for Forza 6. I know that the Fanatec has a setting ( Dri) that has 4 options to change the feel of this it seems to lighten the FFB some during the drift making corrections better. You don’t have to deal with large FFB forces telling you that that your drifting. I started using setting #2 but it does seem to lighten all the FFB especially at center. It is still felt but not as good as it is with the DRI setting off. I remember the atX has 3 different settings that you can change from the wheel and not sure if you are aware. If so just disregard.
I hope this helps you or someone who has the issue of drifting not feeling right.
Dan
By the way I got the friend request as well, thanks and accepted on XBL.
I tried the TX with FM6 first time yesterday, and I am a bit confused …
On FM5 the DOR in the game options and on the wheel were synced, if you changed one the other followed.
Now on FM6 the value in the game options is static, so you can have different settings for the game and the wheel.
I think whatever you set last rules for DOR, either menu-save or modebutton+direction on the wheel.
But I am not sure if force feedback is always influenced by the ingame setting, no matter the wheel setting.
I`ve seen people post setups where the ingame DOR and wheel DOR were different. Going by my own feeling I also thought the ingame value always has an effect independent from the wheel setting.
But I fail to really see the system.
At one point I had pretty good FFB, but found myself incapable of reproducing it even though I memorized the ingame settings.
In general, from what little I tried, I think the FFB is an improvement over FM5, once you find your settings (made difficult by having to go all the way back to the options menu) its somewhat fun. But ...compared to the standards set by recent games its horribly outdated, in the end you get more useful feedback from the controller.
Its alright for racing as you don’t want to break traction. My point is once you break traction the centre point should rotate to the angle of the wheels turning left or right. It did this in forza 2,3,4,5 but for some reason is non existent in forza 6. It does start to rotate when traction is broken but doesn’t consistently tell you where the angle is while full sideways.
I don’t agree with what your saying about DOR as when I go in settings, it adjusts my steering wheel to suit what I select, which is exactly how it was done on forza 5. only difference being it is programmed to tell the wheel to go to 540 on initial start.
Regards
mark
I was refering to the other way round.
On FM5, when you changed DOR right on the wheel (anywhere in the game) and went back to the ingame menu, you found the menu reflected that change. Eg. when you set your wheel to 360 the menu would also say 360.
On FM6, changing DOR on the wheel doesnt reflect in the menu. You can set the wheel to 360 and have the menu value still say 900 (if thats what you set there).
Whether or not this makes any practical difference is what I am trying to find out
I can try myself later today though, experimenting with extreme values.
Add me to the list of users that had the wheel layout change on them for no reason during in between races. Had to me twice - very annoying and add to the fact you have to back out and go to main screen to reset back to preferred layout! Please, put controller tab/settings back in race menu like in the demo T10 Studios. Yes, my TX wheel has the latest firmware patch v49.
Make sure you go to choose your gamertag with the controller up in the top left hand of the home screen, then do it with the wheel before starting up forza.
last, start the game up with the wheel from the home screen.
I’ll second DUI sx mad on this one too…
I always make sure to sign in with my wheel first and have never had the issue…
That said, I never use the “Second-controller-for-headset/chat” BS workaround… So I never talk online… unless it is midday, and/or family is out of the house…
Chat through Kinect just stinks! But then again, I see all kinds of people with wheel/button configs changing on them… particularly when they are trying to use the “Second controller for Chat” work around.
DUI sx mad… Do you use the “Second controller for Chat” when online?
Curious, because you don’t seem to have the problems heard over and over again in the forum…
thanks!
To be honest I haven’t even chatted to anyone yet but I remembered that was a procedure when forza 5 just came out as that had issues also.
Haven’t been good enough to drift with people to join them and chat lol. Is so bloody frustrating as I know how to drift in forza as ive been doing it for years.
I really love the community on forza especially the drifters when were all door to door etc but If this doesn’t get fixed i’ll prob give up on the franchise and go to pc more.
I will try and chat and play tonight to see what happens.
regards
mark
Yeah, I have the procedure printed off the Thrustmaster site, just haven’t felt compelled to try…
BTW — I hear what your saying about PC… I would love to try I-racing, but don’t have the time to commit to getting through their license process.
I love Forza because the Motorsports series is closely linked to truer racing, while the Horizon games can just be plain “arcade-like” fun". Too many people fail to see the distinction between the two though!
I still play horizon (original) on 360 with controller from time to time for fun!
Let us know how your chat session goes… or look me up… I do use my phone and SmartGlass to send messages…
Heath!
Well HNT Awesome,
Tried chat just now and it worked fine.
Procedure I done was turn on Xbox.
Plug charging cable and headset into controller.
Plugged steering wheel in.
Choosed my profile with the controller.
Then Choosed my profile with the wheel.
From then on used the wheel for everything.
Another thing I’ve just noticed while watching replays is that every input of the wheel pivots the car instead of the wheels, it’s like the car is turning back and forth instead of the front wheels.
Regards
Mark
Did you try setting the Wheel-mode in ‘Assists’ to ‘normal’ instead of the ‘simulation’? It seems that ‘normal’ works best with the lacking FFB when the rear steps out…