FH5 vs FH4: comparison of post-launch cars

Forza Horizon Forza Horizon 5 FH5 Discussion
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Feeling more and more disappointed with cars added to Forza Horizon 5 lately, I’ve decided to look back and check why Forza Horizon 4 seemed so much better on that field.

I’ve made a comparison of cars added to both games during the first year after their launches, i.e. up to Series 14 in both FH5 and FH4. Let’s look at some numbers:

FH5 FH4
Total number of cars added up to Series 14 124 150
#NewToForza cars 70 (51 in DLC) 83 (52 in DLC)
Cars returning from FH4 47 -
Cars returning from FH3 2 20
Cars returning from FH2 0 3
Cars borrowed from FM7 (first time in Forza Horizon series) 1 23
Cars borrowed from FM6 (first time in Forza Horizon series) 1 0
Cars borrowed from FM5 (first time in Forza Horizon series) 0 1
Cars brought back from FM4/FH1 (first time on post-X360 platforms) 3 (1 in DLC) 19 (12 in DLC)

As you can see, Playground Games was working harder and added more cars to FH4 in one year. However, at this point we had both expansions released, as the game was expected to reach the end of its lifecycle soon and to be replaced by Forza Horizon 5 after two years since release. There were also three bonus car packs: Best of Bond, Barrett-Jackson (paid), and Mitsubishi (free).

Anyway, the point is that cars added to Forza Horizon 4 were much more interesting, as they came from more diverse sources. Although many vehicles were “recycled”, only a fracture was taken straight from the previous installment. PGG used more cars from other (older) games so it was easier to be excited with them nonetheless, especially with those that were debuting in the open world and/or on modern consoles and PCs.

One could ask: perhaps PGG stopped doing that because there are no cars left to be borrowed from FM7, FH3, or earlier games? I checked that too - there are still plenty of unused vehicles. 222 cars in FM7 and 253 cars in FM4, to be exact (including race models but counting variants with different liveries as one car).

In conclusion I’d like to write something like “let’s hope PGG will do better in year two of FH5’s support”, but… it’d be rather naive, right? I’m rather waiting for the release of Forza Motorsport now, hoping that it will complement Forza Horizon 5 and Turn 10 Studios will deliver enough fresh content and events to be occupied with when Playground Games underwhelms (and perhaps the other way round).

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Thank you for compiling the numbers on this, very interesting.

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Enjoyed looking at this too, only 3 comments from me to be honest.

  1. FH5’s recycling of FH4’s stat looks terrible at first glance compared to 4’s recycling, but 4’s number for FH3 + FM7 cars adds up to only 4 less, and don’t forget FM7 was only a year before FH4.

  2. As much flak as 5 has taken for re-using old cars it will match FH4’s contribution of genuinely new vehicles if half of the next 26 cars are new to Forza ones.

  3. Regardless of whether it’s 43 or 47 or if it was just a single 1 I don’t like that both games have tried dressing up additions from their predecessors as new, it stinks of their absence at launch being intentional, even more so when it’s early on in the game’s life.

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That’s true. However, I think there’s a significant difference between Forza Horizon and Forza Motorsport, and introducing cars from the latter in the former (i.e. liberating them from restraints of racing circuits and letting loose in an open world) feels much better than using again cars from previous game in the same series. I’d like to see more examples like 1970 Dodge Coronet Super Bee, added to FH5 in Series 9 :slight_smile:

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Still waiting for the day the Nissan Safari Turbo makes it into a Horizon game instead of being exclusive to FM7 :skull:

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Nissan Safari Turbo is a perfect example of car that should find way to Forza Horizon from FM7 (one of many actually) :slight_smile:

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Getting cars from FH4 -except Clio- is not bad. There many cars that would make nice addition to FH5. For example: Porsche 356 RSR as an extreme track toy from the early 60s.

Some realy nice collectibles like the 3 woodys we just received in update 14, the upcoming AMC Rebel and Plymouth Fury in series 15.

Hope for more of the good brands like Alfa, Fiat, Lancia.

More nice cars for collectors like Citroen DS23 and 2CV, Pontiac 68 and 73 Firebird, 69 GTO TheJudge, 69 Olds 442, Mercedes-Benz 280SL, Honda S800, Toyota Corolla 1974, Aston-Martin DB4, Ferrari 250 LM, Hudson Hornet, and AMC Hornet, Regalia and Regalia D, Porsche 928 GTS.

There are many more that I can’t recall now.

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I agree. I would love to see a classic Japanese 4x4 showdown between Safari and Landcruiser.

And this is my personal opinion, but I am very disappointed that Dodge Dart GT is not present in FH4 or FH5.
This car was never a commercial success, but in the game it was a fun rally car with a body kit for rallycross.

And the base model Dart was also sold in the Mexican market.
In a slightly extreme way, it was one of the more fitting models for the FH5 map than a million dollar hypercars.

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Agreed, PGG missed the mark on the “Mexican” content for this game. I would have loved to see some of the cars that were specific to Hispanic markets (other than Mexico). Like the Brazilian 1970’s Dodge Charger, which was a mix of Dart ('67-'69) with the roofline of a Charger ('69) and a completely different front end.

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Yes, while Forza Horizon 3 and 4 have distinctly Australian/British flavour in their car roster, FH5 is missing the same thing. It feels bland, almost generic even.

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If looking at FM7 cars I would love to see added to FH5 - hands down it’s the Radical SR8 for me.
Oh Yeah!

SR8

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I’ve compiled some more data on cars to put my comparison in broader context.

  • Forza Horizon 3 had 481 cars in total (i.e. when support ended), while Forza Horizon 4 launched with 469 cars. That’s only 12 less.
  • Forza Horizon 4 ended with 711 cars in total, yet Forza Horizon 5 had only 506 cars on launch. That’s 205 less.
  • 111 cars from FH3 were missing when FH4 launched, but in return it had 99 new cars (i.e. unavailable in FH3).
  • When FH5 launched, 229 cars from FH4 were missing and in return we had… 24 new cars.

(I’ve excluded from all above numbers Forza Edition, Preorder, or Welcome Pack cars. Models with different liveries count as one car)

Of course, we should take into consideration that FH4 was supported for much longer than FH3 and PGG had less time to prepare new content for the launch of FH5. Also transfering every single car from FH4 to FH5 was not necessary.

However, the problem is that PGG cut so many essential cars only to include them later in updates as “new” content. It happened to Aston Martin One-77, Ferrari 250 GT, Ferrari 512 TR, Ferrari 599 GTO, Ford Mustang Mach 1, Mercedes-Benz 300 SLR, Porsche 550 Spyder, and so many others… while at least twice as much still awaits to be brought back (although should never be omitted in the first place).

Anyway, I’d still prefer PGG to introduce more new cars in Forza Horizon (including not only #NewToForza models but also those yet to be seen in games other than Forza Motorsport) instead of giving us vehicles we were just driving in FH4, even essentials. Forza Horizon 5 could use a more unique car roster so that the game felt less repetitive over its predecessor.

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Perfect post.
And to add my personal opinion, I think there were two problems with the FH5 launch car list.

The first is that a number of “variant” models were left on the launch car list while important models were cut.
The second is that many of those variant models were not used in “hard to find”.

Example.
Ferrari in FH5, had many “no variant” models removed from the launch car list, including the 512TR.
On the other hand, all variants of the 458/488 were included in the launch car list.
Of course, in this example we need to take into account that the 458/488 is the model needed to represent Ferrari today and is highly popular among the supercar fan base.
However, the fact that these models had all variants while many unique models without variants were deleted is enough to make one feel a sense of unfairness in the car list.

And the second example.
Of course, there are also models from variant models that were chosen as hard to find.
However, it was more noticeable that “no variant” models and models “including all variants of that model” were selected, and this seemed to give a bad impression, including the aforementioned bias in the list.

And this trend can have a negative impact on the impression of the car list.

I have seen the opinions of car listings for Forza and other racing games on several websites, including this forum. Based on my experience, I would say that variant models tend to be seen by non-fans of the model as being no different than the base model.
In other words, even if there are 20 variants of the S550 Mustang, it will only count as a “Mustang” to non-Mustang fans.

What if in addition to that, many unique models would be deleted or hard to find?
People would feel that the models accessible on autoshow would be greatly reduced and the launch car list would be less attractive.

Not that the variant model is all bad, but they could have learned from the past Forza and chosen a better way.

For example, all unicorns (exclusive cars) up to FM4 were chosen from these variants.
To take an example of a model that also appeared in FH5, the 1997 Mazda RX-7 was available on autoshow and the 2002 Mazda RX-7 Spirit R was a unicorn.

This made it more user-friendly, as players who could not obtain these models could obtain another trim level or stock model as an alternative.
And the fact that the variant was chosen as a unicorn led to such models being more rare and valuable.

I would like to see FH6 better utilize these variant models and make the launch car list a good one.

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Variants of cars is an interesting topic. To me the most puzzling examples included in Forza Horizon 5 are these:

  • 2003 Honda S2000 + 2009 Honda S2000 CR
  • 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT + 2018 Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk
  • 2015 Dodge Challenger SRT Hellcat + 2018 Dodge Challenger SRT Demon

They’re very similar models, differing from each other mainly in performance and/or options of visual modifications. Why PGG have chosen them to be included together while so many unique cars from FH4 have been left behind?

Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy having different variants of the same model. And I’d like to praise PGG for including some of them in mastery trees as unlockables (e.g. Lamborghini Diablo GTR, available from the mastery tree of Diablo SV). That’s cool idea, there could be more vehicles hidden that way.

However, with so many cars from FH4 missing on launch of FH5 I’d prefer having as many unique models as possible instead of similar variants. Those could be saved for later.

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I’m pretty shocked at the amount of cut cars. I know PG isn’t upfront about licensing but in regards to brands like Lancia etc, there were licensing problems.

I can at least be understandable with niche brands like ATS or Eagle UK, being licensed in a certain way.

Are you sure? Because the 512TR is basically another variant of the Testarossa. Personally I like the original 80s Testarossa than that.

Regarding variants they can add as many as they please. The one about the Honda S2K are different generations (the 2003 model is an AP1 while the sloppily-designed 2009 S2K CR is an AP2). The rest are merely facelift models.

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In this case, “no variant” does not refer to real life.
It refers to the presence or absence of variant cars in the Forza series.
The Testarossa family in Forza has always been only the 512TR.

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Now year later 2024. 831 cars seeason 32

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Yeah, my comparison aged badly (thankfully!). Since the second year of support for FH5 we’re getting more cars and they’re more carefully picked, also balance between adding #NewToForza models and recycling old ones from FH4 is much better. Maybe I’ll update those stats one day to give PG some due credit :slight_smile:

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830 odd cars is crazy but hey aint done yet.

I made a list on the new Motorsport cars that are in Motorsport 7 Skip FH4 and FH5 and just feels like Turn 10 dont allow Playground to have them. Some new cars on there too.

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