Driving the Lambo Cent. near the start of the game still feels the same as in demo . However, after getting and driving the BMW M4 and the BMW X6 M model the FFB feels improved. On the road the M4 and X6 had better FFB feel than the Lambo - the Lambo felt it had SUPER power steering feel the way a real Lexus sedan is devoid of any road feel, with low steering effort everywhere. I can turn the wheel left or right and there is no weight and very little FFB weight even when cornering. However, I felt more with the M4 and X6 when doing the same on the road. This leads me to think that FFB strength is dependent on vehicle type rather than actual tire width. Perhaps PG/T10 are trying to make the exotics responsive and light on their feet? But there should be more feeling of weight in the wheel for exotics I would think - due to the huge tire width used on these type of vehicles and some of them are just as heavy as some 4X4s.
I haven’t bought or driven another exotic car yet (still early in the game) so I cannot fully confirm this at the moment - just based on driving the Lambo at the start tonight, like in the demo. However, if this is the case then IMHO it’s a wrong design choice or decision IMHO. FFB weight should be based on tire width and not vehicle type when these cars are driven on the road.
I didn’t notice any issue with FFB weight when off roading with any of the vehicles - FFB weight felt more natural which I think has to do with the ground type instead of vehicle type with regards to FFB feel.
Can PG/T10 please just test this out and see how FFB feels with the FFB weight based on tire width vs vehicle type? Come to think of it tire width plus vehicle weight should also be considered when calculating FFB weight/feel for each car vs just vehicle type (which I think is who it currently works), IMHO of course. I’m certain it will improve FFB weight/feel for the exotics.
So far I’m liking the game with the exception I mentioned above. Keep up the good work and for listening to your Forza community. Now if you can put back the convertible versions of some of the exotics that you had in FH1 that would make alot of people happy including myself
PS the Huracan and 488 Spyder and would look beautiful in this game.
This! This is exactly my experience with G27 on PC. No feedback at all in first 50 degrees, especially when driving fast and then exponentially too much weight more you turn. Doesn’t feel rightat all. Anyone know workaround to fix this? Or is it just the game and its FFB sucking big time?
Xbox One using Thrustmaster TX, 900 DOR, FFB 100, VIB 50. Vibration feels real strong at 100, so for the sake of wheel longevity I set it to 50, LOL
I agree with others that first 50 degrees there is no initial “bite” or strong on center feel to FFB, just a sense of looseness and then FFB builds (with exception of Lambo as mentioned previously).
I’ve stated previously in the past so many times about comparing FFB, but GT5 and GT6 has the best implementation of FFB on consoles EVER. It’s very intuitive at how natural it feels. IMHO, PG/T10 should use these 2 games as a reference when it comes to FFB. I played the heck out GT5 so I would know! GT6 not as much because PD messed around with their graphics engine and there would be stutters/frame drops when going around corners. Anyways, they need to check out FFB on GT5. BTW, I used a Logitech G29 with PS3.
If you think gt5 and 6 are the benchmark on consoles, i think you should try assetto corsa, dirt rally and project cars (have to fiddle with it but the options are there). All are multiplatform and all of them are excellent. They each have different approaches to ffb implementation but they all do it well.
The truth is theres plenty of games they could’ve used as a benchmark but they dont seem to care. Im also not too sure if many of them even use a wheel at all. This is the main problem, if the developers dont use a peripheral, how can it ever be good.
I read a post by someone who worked at turn 10 on a different website, he wasnt there long or anything he had whatever type of random job to do for 6 and he was saying how they have a rig set up at the studio and he’d play it during his lunch breaks. In his opinion he thought it was great and “much harder than iracing”. This is what i assume the thought process is like at turn 10/playground. They think by making the wheel controls more difficult that it means its more realistic, but thats actually the opposite of reality.
If anyones driven a real car theyd know the actual act of driving is not hard at all. Cars have been around awhile now and they’ve gotten easier to drive. Im not saying its easy to race a car and drive at 10/10ths, but even just cruising around in forza you can lose traction at 30mph going around a corner, this isn’t realistic.
One of the things i noticed when playing assetto corsa is just how easy it was to just get right in and just drive the cars. Every car is different and you can feel that race cars have much more grip than road cars. Changing from street tires to semislicks on road cars makes a huge difference as it should. Everything just feels natural like it should, you get a lot of positive feedback as to whats going on with the car.
The adjustments you can make even on the console version enables you to find a setting thats feels good to you and this is where forza gets it wrong. Ffb is very subjective, the settings i use, the things i want to feel is different from everyone else. In the system forza uses they choose what levels of feedback will be felt and just allow us to adjust the overall strength.
I think the number one priority of any developer making a driving simulation is to try to make people trust that their simulation is accurate. I think forza has accomplished this with a controller, i feel as though the cars react and behave as they should for the most part. But when it comes to the wheel i have no trust in their physics simulation whatsoever. Things dont feel natural and it breaks immersion and this is the reason why people buy these expensive wheels, they want more immersion than a controller could ever give.
I’m using the Thrustmaster TX on Xbox and the main game still has exactly the same lack of FFB on tarmac as the demo, even if i set rotation down to 540
Off road feels good but as soon as you hit tarmac the wheel feels like it goes totally dead in your hands (like the old rubber band style wheel I used to have on PS1 for Ridge Racer).
Can’t fathom how they got it so wrong when is what so perfect in Horizon 2, and plenty of people here told them about it from the demo. Disappointing as Playground & Turn 10 usually get such high quality games out the door for day1 - wheel FFB is so fundamental in a racer I’m really surprised they released it like this.
Seems to me like they nerfed the onroad ffb just so when you do go offroad you feel a major difference. The ffb is once again a curated experience, other than steering linearity which is worthless no other sliders were added from apex.
All this talk about the physics and all these different surface types is apparently just pr talk because none of it is relayed through the wheel. They refuse to tie the ffb in with tire and suspension physics, choosing to go with fully canned effects which imo seems like it would just be more work to me.
I still believe ffb is still just a modified vibration system from the control pad. I really thought with the release of apex and now horizon on pc the wheel controls would finally get the attention it deserved but i was wrong. While apex does have more ffb sliders, it only helps to mask the inherent problems found in the wheel implementation.
I was extremely vocal about the ffb in forza 6 as were almost 50 pages worth of others, but i wont be anymore. For that much community feedback to fall on deaf ears is highly dissapointing to say the least. I have given up on using the wheel with these games which it almost feels like turn 10/playground have wanted all along. Its obvious they’re not concerned in the least about it and game after game it shows. So congratulations turn 10/playground, you win.
I’ve sunk a good deal or hours in now. Driven all kinds of cars in different conditions.
Somehow, I am able to have very intuitive control of the cars, more so than in any Forza since I started using my G920 a year ago.
The FFB does feel weak on tarmac, but I seem to be able to transition from slide to slide and I’m enjoying it!?
Agree on the assessment that there is little feel near centre then it weights up, particularly off road.
I did fire up FH1 on BC a few hours before FH3 unlocked and had a blast drifting up and down the hill climb. First experience for me on a wheel with the previous gen.
Well, this is just very sad to hear, but I have to say I’m not reaaly surprised, I did have a bit of hope but T10 has shown us very little attention or even acnoledgment in the past.
Forza was the only reason I bought an xb1, and with the lack of everything wheel related (and the fact I can now get it on pc) I recently decided to sell my xbox one as I no longer have any motivation to play my favourite title.
FFB needs a drastic overhaul, one that uses pneumatic trail and lateral load as a basis
Even I am saying it is too bad to even make any use of this time around, so you know it has to be bad; lol.
I had to swap over to using my gamepad lastnight it was that bad, just no information at all; and it made it really horrible to drive around. On the plus side the wheel does spin when drifting, so I guess they got that particular issue from FM6 resolved. Such a shame, as I finally had a working wheel for the release of a forza game; I was really looking forward to playing it right through with a wheel for once.
Doesn’t surprise me. I thought this might happen given the demo FFB wheel thread complaints and I didn’t expect them to really resolve this issue in a meaningful way. Perhaps there will be a day one patch on the actual release day but I doubt it will improve it by much.
I’m not particularly impressed by Forza’s wheel implementation in FH2 or FM6. Usable but not as good as other games. I haven’t purchased FH3. If I came on here and heard that the wheel felt really good with this game then I’d have been tempted to buy it. Ah well, nae skin of their nose.
I imagine this game still feels really good with a control pad as the Forza franchise certainly excels at that and I guess the game will still be fun to play using a pad.
When I had my Thrustmaster TX Forza 6 felt awkward to me. I upgraded to a fanatec CSW V2 and it felt so much better. It’s actually enjoyable now but with Horizon 3 it feels off(on PC anyways). It feels tight around center unlike what people are saying about other wheels but when turning it gets harder and any feedback goes away almost like the wheel is clipping but I know it’s not. It’s like it goes from feeling normal around center to just artificial spring after about 15 degrees. I’d be happy if it felt like Forza 6 with the CSW.
I’m posting this in here as well (from a thread I started in the support section about wheel problems). Is anyone else experiencing one of these problems?
After playing the game for several hours I’ve gotten used to the FFB when corning on tarmac and it’s decent enough, though I had to resort to turning on TCS and STM for some success . However, the CURRENT issue still is the lack of any centering force when turning the wheel 5-10 degrees to the left or right from center when driving from medium to high speed as mentioned by myself and others. We all now that majority of sports cars are set up with variable assist - light steering at low speeds to aid in parking, but as speed starts to ramp up then assist is turned nearly off. That’s where you have that feeling of resistance when you turn from center. There is none of that feeling currently in FH3.
Please PG/T10 can you please put in an option to increase FFB resistance off center? Perhaps call it “Wheel Centering Force”, where we can adjust it from Low/Normal to High. Users with Fanatec wheels can set it to Normal as resistance seems to built in from Fanatec, but us Thrustmaster TX users can set WCF to medium or high based on our preference. We can then call it a day with regards to floaty FFB when driving on tarmac, LOL.
BIGGER issue…
I can sympathize with all wheel users out there and why many think that “we” wheel users aren’t getting our fair shake when it comes to FH and FM when compared to how the game works for users with controllers. The issue is fairly simple - users with controllers have the ability to flick the steering using the steering thumbstick to get out of oversteer situations with simply a flick of the thumb - Captain Obvious. However, the same can’t be said for wheel users where we have to put in a great deal of input by turning the wheel one way and then sometimes the other way and unfortunately not getting the same result because the wheel has to travel far greater distance for same short amount of time, especially at 900 DOR. Even at lower DOR it’s very difficult. Also, I shouldn’t have to resort to turning on certain aids like TCS or STM when using the wheel to help alleviate the situation. This I think is the biggest complaint - we wheel users are not getting enough FFB effects from the wheel letting us know what the car is doing so we can take preemptive action (i.e. prevent the car from oversteering for example). The only clues aside from FFB is visual and audible clues- car has started to rotate and not pointing where it should be (oversteer/understeer) and sound of tires squeeling, but by that time it’s already too late. In real life it’s called “seat of your pants” feel. FFB should be that seat of your pants feel that unfortunately is not quite there in FH or FM series.
As game designers please find a way to give us wheel users clues through FFB as to what the car is doing or about to do, especially in an oversteer situation?
How about this as a possible solution. Why not have FFB in the wheel initiate countersteer on my behalf when the vehicle is on the verge of fish tailing? This is all the tangible “seat of the pants” clue that I need. With careful practice and experience I can learn to use this and immediately apply short and quicker countersteering input to get the car going where it needs to go, before the point of no return. I think this would go along way in addressing most of the constant gripping you hear from us PG/T10 about FFB.
If the FFB system used proper self aligning torque calculated from the pneumatic trail, caster angle and lateral load then counter steering would not be an issue at all and you would not have to add fake countersteer effects.
If the ffb was made this way you wouldn’t need to fake centering strength either, just adusting your caster angle will have an impact on it, bottom line is it would make you wheel feel like an extension of the car which is something forza has never been able to capture.
. However, after getting and driving the BMW M4 and the BMW X6 M model the FFB feels improved. On the road the M4 and X6 had better FFB feel than the Lambo - the Lambo felt it had SUPER power steering feel the way a real Lexus sedan is devoid of any road feel, with low steering effort everywhere. I can turn the wheel left or right and there is no weight and very little FFB weight even when cornering. However, I felt more with the M4 and X6 when doing the same on the road. This leads me to think that FFB strength is dependent on vehicle type rather than actual tire width. Perhaps PG/T10 are trying to make the exotics responsive and light on their feet? But there should be more feeling of weight in the wheel for exotics I would think - due to the huge tire width used on these type of vehicles and some of them are just as heavy as some 4X4s.