In the beginning, Forza motorsport was a sparky game that was based on racing with typical cars that players could upgrade and tune to challenge others in on the race track. Forza Motorsport 1 on original xbox didn’t have much online, so you pretty much only raced with the AI, maybe Rossi, Shumacher and many other so you really needed to learn to tune your car in order to compete with those top AI performers. throughout the years, I feel Forza has begun to lose that spark. Forza stood out from games like need for speed, midnight club, and project gotham because players in Forza could enjoy a more advanced competitive experience by taking the time learning the physics and handling by upgrading and tuning a car in efforts to reach optimal performance on a track; ultimately the goal is to win the race with your tune. below I will list a few reasons that I believe attributed to Forza drifting away from being a tuners game.
Clubs exchanging tuning setups in Forza 4: some of you best tuners out there formed alliance with some of the best racers, claimed racing clubs identifying yourself with a new header name for your gamertag. Your mistake started when you emailed your tuning setups for leaderboard cars to your racing members. Many of those racers befriended you just to con you out of a tune, quitted your club then went on to proclaim the tune as their own. So folks, some of these tunes you are downloading for leaderboard cars may not be originally created from the person that posted it up to share. its sort of like a robin hood thing, they got those tunes for you in a dirty fashion, while the original tuner is somewhere crying because he/she is not being rewarded for the work in tuning that Mazda 787b or Sauber c9. now their unique creation is being disbursed throughout the entire racing community with someone else name on their tune. The next forza with clubs should create a Club Share system where tuners and design artist can share content specifically to their club and not have to share actual ideas for setups to club members.
That One Car: predominately, most of the the excitement of the game now is online in the racing lobbies. Why is it that across every class there is that one car that can out perform all others in almost all tracks in the multiplayer. Out of all the gazillions of Forza cars to purchase in game or as part of dlc content we should be able to upgrade and tune every car to be highly competitive to compete with each other on lobby tracks. for an instance, go to a Forza 6 pclass racing lobby, most of the time out of 24 players there are at least 17 jaguar xjr9’s and maybe 5 Mazdas. But thankfully it is not as bad as it used to be, before the jag came onto the scene it was the Mazda 787b only, in Forza 3, you would get kicked out of the lobby if you were not driving the 787b smh. For me, if I see other racers using a different car and using their own tune I would pick a similar car and race with them instead. At this point, its not that I want to win the entire race but because I enjoy more to race in a different car. Ya know, some days I just get tired if wearing the same set of clothes; racing in the same car all the time.
Racers Only: there are a lot of good racers out there and many claim to not have time or interest to learn about tuning so they just grab the best leading tune and hit the track running. well, thats just fine and dandy but the point you are missing is the fame and glory of winning races with your own tune in Forza. Now, if i was using a leaderboard tune and barely won a race against an opponent that had built his own tune, I would have the upmost respect for that racer and would recognize that he would probably win if using the same leaderboard tune as me. Why I think that way you ask? because I myself have spent hundreds of hours overall tuning Forza cars and I know first hand how difficult it is to tune your ride to compete with those top tunes. And in many cases after hours of tuning, your personal tune is still 1 sec per lap or more behind what you can achieve using a downloaded top tune.
I guess I might be a bit attached in getting the most entertainment out of Forza by utilizing all of the great features with tuning and upgrading. While the next Forza is coming soon I fear that upgrading and tuning will become an unnecessary part of the game eventually there would be no need for it; because only top tuners are being recognized. I mean why would everyone even download tunes when cars could be pre-tuned at max pi by the developers straight out of the box,“sarcasm”. This is the path I don’t want to see Forza take. So, my real concern is the possibility of there being incentives in lobby races for tuning your own car.
Thank you for the trip down memory lane but I don’t know what the point is per say. Clubs in FM7 would be nice. I’ve been part of clubs in most of the Forza games including FM4 and it is a nice feature to have. I highly doubt however that they will give any real bonuses for self tuning above and beyond the credits they give for selling tunes. I can say for one that I have absolutely no clue how to tune and I’m glad that tunes can be shared and downloaded, otherwise it wouldn’t be worth driving online at all.
Hey, Kdogg, thanks for reply. Let me clarify. I agree the idea for clubs in forza 4 was awesome, but It was the behavior of members that made it tore the clubs apart. I’m specifically referring to those clubs that wanted pole position on the leaderboards. They brought in some of the best tuners to share setups to who they thought were “loyal members” but those dirty members stole those tuning setups, quit the club and started their own clubs. So basically we have people that don’t even know how to tune, sharing some of the best tunes out there. Wait, there’s a twist, tunes carry from one game to the next, notice you don’t see many downloaded tunes at the very top of the leaderboards in forza 6? Well that’s because those shared top tunes are actually not the best, that’s because some of the smartest club owners in forza 4 purposely shared setups for inferior tunes. I was in one of those top leaderboard clubs but I realized really quick they earned their way by stealing tunes. One club wanted me to join because I was a pretty decent racer in forza 4 xclass and already had my own tune, they insisted me to share my tune and they will share theirs; I gave them setup numbers to a mediocre tune for Mazda 787b, I did not want a really good tune to get in a wreckers hands.
Basically, I hope forza 7 never allows the 787b back in xclass again because of this issue With forza 4 clubs. I want all tuners to receive recognition for the hard work they put in the ir tune and not be forced to share ideas with dirty clubs at the top.
One way to fix this is for forza 7 to have club share, this way tuners and design artists can share content without sharing ideas.
It varies to be frank. If I spent a lot of time on it, they usually come out pretty good. Usually they lean on loose side which never fairs well in tune comps.
Anywho, back on topic. Tune stealing is common the more you get involved with teams. It’s not too bad now since hardly anyone cares about setting top times unlike other games where we had a metric to rank teams.
It is true that some will intentionally share lesser tunes. I know of one tune out right now that is still #1 capable but is a lesser version of the better tune.
It is also true that some teams will intentionally invite racers who have shown to run good times in order to exploit them for tunes.
It is also true that it gets really dirty with high class teams when it comes to this. Lots of ego and backstabbing issues.
It is also true some players simply don’t care and will share a tune or will open source the tune.
hey Swerve, you kinda get what I’m saying. and you seem like you been in Forza for a while.
yea that forza spark has been lost over the pass couple of games. and I’m here to try and bring it back lol.
let me tell you a true story about how I found out who the real racers are. Yesterday I played Forza 6 spec class online. this is were everyone had to ride the same car without upgrades and tuning. everyone was in a charger Daytona at Daytona infield race track. I started in 5th on the grid, race starts, almost everyone eventually passes me around about the second corner. My wife on the couch shouted at me “why you all letting them beat you!” I said “I’m not letting them, its because in this class, we all have to race in the same car with no upgrades or tuning”. she never really seen me do that poor on the race track. I’m laughing but struggling really hard to keep 19th position at this point. knowing that I been playing Forza since the beginning of time, I should be an expert and nobody should beat me, right? no. I spend majority of my time in the tuning section in Forza. This is were the game shines for me, heck I’m somewhere in top 100s overall in Pclass and 20th world place in the amazing Nordschleife and I still don’t even know how to pronounce that name right. I’m not offended by people downloading tunes I’m glad many people don’t want to learn to tune their race car, it gives me a better position on the track. I admit, I’m not a very good racer and not to brag, but my tunes that are designed and catered to speak to me puts me ahead on the track. Even against fast racers using popular tunes those popular tunes are versatile and made for everyone, and mostly easy-to-handle beginner tunes. In general speaking, my personal tunes are more difficult to handle but provides a faster lap time from the tunes I share. Some people here may mistakenly think I’m upset about them downloading tunes, I have no interest in that. For those people I will say this, do you think raceboy77 would share out a tune that is capable for you to beat him with it? me thinks not lol. but not to say he wouldn’t but he would have to know your exact driving style in order to break that tune faster for you.
And Swerve, I think open source tunes provides the basics of where to start tuning a car after upgrading, but unfortunately without the proper knowledge of where to go from there, some may still end up with a crappy tune. Knowledge is power.
I hate when racers just pick up the No.1 tune from the leaderboards and race. Sure they are talented racers but it’s painful when you see a racer pick up a tune, the best car and put on the best assists. This is why I run in the spec class lobby. That’s where true drivers shine. I wish there was a “your tune only” and “no assists” and also “wheel/controller only” lobbies. I wish there was more emphasis on using your own tune. I spend weeks if not months tuning my own cars and unfortunately I’m hampered by using a wheel which is around 1-2 seconds slower on average a lap compared to what I can do on a controller. It sucks that you have to tune your car almost opposite on a wheel as well.
My solution to get more people using there own tunes is this… if you use somebody’s tune, you will be deducted 25% of your XP and CR that you earned at the end of the Race, that of which goes to the creator of the tune you are using. It’s harsh but it’d make lobbies far more interesting.
Does anybody still care about XP and CR? I think I quit even thinking about either of those way back in FM2.
Ugh… when I read your post, seeing – “ultimately the goal is to win the race with your tune” – I died a little inside.
To me, the absolute best part of the game is the simulated driving. Nothing is better than a “spec” race, where each player is using the exact same car… no variations in upgrades, no variations in tuning. That way you know how you compare in terms of controlling the car. Nobody is worried about (or complaining about) any “leaderboard cars.”
It has annoyed me to no end over the years to finish a race - after having made some really excellent passes - and hearing “wow, you’ve really got a great tune!” (as if you’re just holding a button down and the “tune” is driving the car).
I also think the ability to download tuning setups is very helpful for new players. Your wife was asking why you were letting everyone beat you, when you were in a “spec” lobby. That’s tough enough for a “newbie,” but at least he can say to himself: “with practice, I can compete.” Imagine how it would be for new players who see someone else running multiple seconds faster, and being told “well, you have to learn how to tune before you can even think about being competitive.”
Quite frankly, if it were up to me, multiplayer would be predominantly “spec” racing, with only a few lobbies for, essentially, “tuning competition.”
Sorry but your solution to get more people using their own tune makes no sense.
Tuners already get enough money from racers who use their tune and you can’t force people to learn how to tune.
To be honest i can’t see any reason to force ppl to use their own tune, i have no time to learn how to tune and when i enter in game i won’t bother to tune my car instead of race…
Now, i don’t have enough time to invest in learning to tune but i bought the game to race, like many other ppl, why do i have to get a minus to my exp and cr just for using someone else’s tune?
I mean the tuner already got money from my download, money for my like money for my use, if ppl see me winning with that tune he get more potential ppl to share his tune and now me and any ppl who use his tune, have to also give him 25% of our exp and 25% of our cr?
Nothing else?
Can i skip this -25% exp with credit card?
I have to say that one of my favorite features in Forza is the downloadable tunes. I am poor at it and have very little patience with tuning. I love downloading a good tune and using it. It makes my game so much more enjoyable for me. I have made some very good tunes for me but it is a hit and miss and I make way more crappy tunes I will never share. A would much rather grab a great tune from a great tuner and just have fun.
The incentive is that I can change and improve even little things on my own tunes, whereas with downloaded tunes I either use them as they are, or do not.
Or at least that’s how things run in Forza Horizon 3.
The best thing to do is to stop worrying about how other people play the game. Downloaded tune, own tune, club tune, assists, line, dont worry about how other people use the features of the game.
There’s nothing magical about tunes anyway, some work great, some dont. 95% of your laptime is mainly your skill, not some secret shock settings being hidden from you.
It seems the OPs main issue is not people using downloaded tunes but the chance of others stealing tunes and getting credit for them. He mostly references older games and I’m pretty sure the system has improved since FM4 in terms of content credit protection. Tunes are locked if they aren’t yours and the creator’s name stays on it.
It still comes down to worrying about things you cant have any control over.
You’re just wasting time if you worry about who joins what group and why, what they do with their tunes, paints or anything else.
On top of which no one really knows if the tune xxXMad SkillzXxx handed out was the one he really uses or if the copy put up in the storefront is again, a legit copy. If people give their stuff away… there’s nothing that can or should be done about.
Just play the game how you want, dont worry about what other people do and leave the drama behind which only takes away from your enjoyment of the game.
99% of the time I use my own tune but I don’t feel any difference whatsoever if I use some else’s and really couldn’t care any less about someone using someone else’s tune. It’s ludicrous anyone would give a damn about that. Never even enters my head to think less of someone using someone else’s tune. Maybe they’ve got a wife, 3 children, 2 dogs and work 60 hours a week. Get over yourself.
Sorry dude but you’re referencing problems that literally don’t exist:
If someone told you the numbers for a good tune, that’s not getting it in a “dirty” way, and the top tuners literally do not care if you apply the same principles on other cars, or even the same car for that matter. And if they did, they wouldn’t intentionally give you the numbers in the first place, they’d just share the setup. The only lobby setup I ever made myself was a Ford GT using numbers a teammate of mine gave me for a different car. It’s shared and my name is on the tune, and he knows that it exists. I don’t see him crying.
“Leaderboard tunes.” No such thing. In hoppers the Car > Tune every time. Under the PI system certain cars are naturally going to do better than others. Cars like the BAC Mono, 08 Viper, and the BBLM are naturally under PI’d which is part of the reason why they’re so overpowered in the first place. Making a tune for one of these yourself doesn’t change that fact, especially since there’s very few ways to screw up those cars badly enough to where they wouldn’t be capable of running at least a top 100 time.
“Do you think raceboy77 would share out a tune that is capable for you to beat him with it? me thinks not lol. but not to say he wouldn’t but he would have to know your exact driving style in order to break that tune faster for you.” A lot of Raceboy’s lobby tunes are kinda garbage but it has nothing to do with him being worried about being beat, or being a bad tuner. It only comes down to two factors:
He’s made a tune for almost (if not every) car in the game. With that insane amount of cars to tune it’s literally impossible to tune every car as best as it can be tuned.
A lot of the cars he’s made are from early after the game was released, while people were still trying to get a feel for tuning on a new game.
Raceboy and a lot of the top tuners are people who can easily beat 99.9% of the Forza playerbase even when everybody is forced into the same car and same setup. They are not hiding anything from anyone.
And finally, I know it’s already been said but I feel absolutely zero difference between winning in someone else’s tune and my own tune. A lot of the top guys will tell you the same thing.
I assume you’re referring to me. If that’s the case I think you need to read what I said a little bit more closely.
Literally the whole point of what I just said was that using your own tune on a leaderboard car doesn’t make you better than someone who uses the top tune on that same leaderboard car in terms of lobby racing.
Bit of an emotional rollercoaster going on in this thread, eh? Only real addition Forza 7 needs on top of the live/in-lobby tuning feature that has already been announced would be direct 1-to-1 tune/livery sharing. Perfect for giveaway prizes, gifts, and keeping tuners hard work exclusively private to who they want (and don’t want) to use.
I’m no tuner myself, average on most cars with only a few are really good (Maserati Tipo Birdcage in B&A Class, Lotus E23 in X Class for no assists/TCS) but there’s no denying that the people who are brilliant at tuning sacrifice a lot of time and energy for their work, making it shame that they’re left forced to share their tunes to the entire player base if they just want one or two friends to quickly pick it up.
I run D class in Forza 6 almost exclusively and very few cars in D class benefit from a tune more than the build and car choice to begin with. In fact, most of the cars I run don’t even have tunable parts on them because I think they waste PI points that can be put into power and compensated with driver skill. I am very rusty ATM because I haven’t felt the need to play Forza much lately, but I could stay near the front most races in cars with stock suspensions and brakes. The last time I did play online someone used a top time Willys Jeep on Yas and cut all the corners to beat me in my 70 Challenger. That drives me more crazy than any “tune” or lack thereof ever would. It’s way more important IMO to create a sense of responsibility throughout the community. If the game successfully encourages fair and well behaved driving practices I would be much happier than if everyone had to use their own build and tune online.
Of course corner cutting is a completely different topic from tuning and tends to spark fires on these forums, so I will not spread that poison any farther. I will say though that sharing tunes and paints has been one of the better features added in by the developers. It takes hours to learn how to do even basic things in the livery editor and in the tuner. Some people just want to hop online and have a good time, and I see no fault with them being able to run a car that someone else put plenty of time and detail into the tune and paint job on the car. It’s just a game, not everyone is going to take it very seriously.
I really enjoyed the cycled production hopper from Forza 4, because it really was just production cars. Adding race cars into the mix means people are bouncing around between different assist settings and more. I tried racing in the one on Forza 6 and the Lotus E23 kept coming up and if I forgot to turn on traction control the race was over for me before it even began.
