How about we have a talk on the atrocious post-release support of Forza 7, shall we?

Forza Motorsport Legacy Motorsport FM7 Discussion
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I love this game. I really do. I play it daily. I have lots of fun racing whatever I feel like. Even the trucks.

But, unfortunately, the things I’m seeing with post-release support are considering making me place my loyalties back into rival developers.

The situation some DLC and locked cars have shipped in is absolutely inexplicable. The 1932 Ford Coupe was the most infamous example, with broken bodykits you couldn’t even select in the menu. Well, that one got fixed, but still not “properly” fixed, as the yellow door outline on the sides of the car does not continue onto the doors if you select either of the custom bodykits. And now we have the 924 Carrera GTS with what amounts to effectively broken performance, as the custom bodykit does not have the right stance (wheels too much into the cockpit) and the custom tire width upgrades available for a car equipped with the bodykit are completely wrong, the front is locked at 205 and the rears have a 305 with the various other upgrades the same as the standard. Considering this DLC has been delayed for more than a week, the state of this car is tragic.

If it wasn’t enough, there have been numerous bugs in cars since the release of the game, and since past games even, which remain unfixed. 1997 BMW M3’s windshield wipers move, but not in the correct way. 2013 Audi R8 5.2 Plus’ stock wheels have paint glitches on them, a bug they’ve had since Horizon 3 and which is shared with the 2016 #24 Team RLL BMW M6 GTLM. 2015 Audi S3 Sedan has the wrong parts animated in the cockpit when you shift. 2013 BMW M6 does not feature shifting animations in the cockpit. Mazda MX-5 Cup has a paddle-shifting animation, which is wrong, as the car comes as a stick shift. 1969 Dodge Charger R/T’s Race front bumper (it was “Race” in Horizon 3) is listed as “Street” for some reason, which blocks the car from having adjustable front aero and hurts its competitiveness. 2018 Bugatti Chiron’s custom wheels can have body paint on the hubcaps instead of the appropriate wheel manufacturer logo (from the top of my head this happens mostly with HRE wheels, some Enkei, etc.). Various missing logos from the upgrade screen such as RWB in the 1995 Porsche 911 GT2 and the KMC logo in the menu for the XD228 Machete aftermarket wheel. And these are the bugs I was able to list from memory, as there have been many cars I haven’t tried yet.

We all know every game has bugs and it takes time to fix them. However, what we are seeing with Forza 7’s post-release support is that new bugs are introduced in patches and new content starts out as buggy despite having been in development for a long time. This situation concerns all of us, because we are losing trust in Turn 10’s ability to fix the issues with the game, which will ultimately lead to the franchise’s very image becoming tarnished in the eyes of the general public, as if the locked cars issues and VIP fiasco hadn’t done enough damage already. And, with the heavy promotion of ForzaRC, it just feels like all the bad with the game is being swept under the rug while the picture you get in the streams is that of a perfect game in which everything goes according to plan, which couldn’t be further from the truth. The internet knows and, at the end of the day, it’s a random screenshot of the glitched bodykit of the 924 Carrera GTS that goes viral, not the news of your official e-sports tournament.

In short, I believe someone in the team should come to us and try to address why we are seeing so many hiccups with the post-release content and support. Because we are not being treated as well as we’d like, and you might lose plenty of loyal fans because of random bad jobs like these. I would rather play a bug-free Forza Motorsport than a bug-free Gran Turismo.

Remember that the casuals may bring in the money, but it’s the diehards who keep the game alive. :slight_smile:

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I think they need to hire some of us. It seems like they have no real car enthusiasts working for them anymore.

I remember when BLKJ had a member working there and the input he gave helped make forza 3 and 4 what it was.
Then he left for another job and it’s gone downhill since.

Also, inb4 lock or someone calls you entitled/whiner/ect.

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While I agree with your post, it’s not that they are no longer car people… It’s sheer incompetence. As demonstrated in your screenshot in the other thread, the 924 bodykit is unfinished. Not buggy, unfinished! The tire width upgrades are placeholders, the wheels have not been moved to match the fenders and there’s no damage model.

Even car converters in the GTA modding scene aren’t this incompetent.

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Can’t navigate my garage, and it’s not reliable to show the correct car. The lighting on most stages is like a dark ugly mess. I love storms and grey Moody skies, but this is something else.

This mess of a game makes sense though. Forza 6 would’ve been perfect to build on but the DLC support for that game was almost non existent, for such a great game that I played every day.

Six months later and I still can’t use my garage. I will never trust another Forza game again, especially when it comes to post game support. Also, 7 cars a month is not enough meat for a triple A racing game.

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Try scrolling up and down in the garage using the left and right triggers.

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Agree 100% Don’t think i will be sticking around for another forza. Today was the last of my $100, and it wasn’t worth it. I feel robbed, and mislead. Not whinning, just feel disrespected by turn 10.

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The Brabham from the last pack has no visible mirrors in the cockpit view as well as no shift animation at all and the bolts for the windshield seem to be about 6 polygons with no apparent textures.

I haven’t had a chance to see this month’s car pack, but from what I’ve seen it will probably be more of the same. Turn 10 really need to hire a PR team that know what it doing. Having a Twitter and mixer account just isn’t enough to keep a happy customer base.

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I used to think of Forza titles as rock-solid, reliable experiences where only the occasional bug would slip through the development process.

After Forza Motorsport 7, I no longer have that perception.

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Menus has been better now but it still has this one but really frustrating big problem. When you find tunes, you get only ones which load on initial screen. Rest of them are E100.
That and also on liveries it takes ages to load next batch. Small few kb thumbnails takes up to 30s to 1m to appear. Shouldn’t be a problem with fibre optics.

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This is a long time FM issue, which STILL exists. Searching for a tune is pointless.
I think FM7 is a good game, but a terrible Forza Motorsport game. Does this make sense?

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I’m completely with NightDriver7800 on this matter.

While on some level I can understand, but I don’t approve that, the state of the game it came out in September (deadlines, One X release date) and people, who pre-ordred the game, were treated as a free labor (who themselves payed for the work they were doing) for testing out the game for Xbox One X release, I don’t understand the incompetence and the lack of communication with the player base to ask opinions, how to improve the product.

Every single update or addition to the game have brought more issues and problems. I mean E V E R Y S I N G L E update. The game had and still has some of the same problems FH3 had, which is strange, because most of the issues have been fixed in FH3. There is like no communication between the teams nor T10 and PG. For a long time the game lacked trivial GUI elements like CR field in the level up rewards screen, no visual (colour) distinction between lap times (was my lap better or worse than my previous one); on screen map had squares to indicate cars, which made the map useless, since you couldn’t differentiate anything from there, if the cars were close enough etc etc etc.

There has been made questionable game design choices and many of us just can’t understand, why those were implemented. I won’t bring those out here, because anybody, who has been reading this forum, knows, what those are.

I don’t know, what is going on, but to me it seems like there is some sort of middle-management/management problem. The vision of the top guys gets lost or gets distorted before it gets to people, whose job is to implement that vision, or vision is not explained well enough to make it happen. The deadlines are too short, but nobody asks for more time and also there is basically no testing whatsoever because of that. Plus the lack of dialog between T10 and the Forza community and stagnation of the series (same old issues, “improvements” that nobody really asked for, many features have been taken out, restrictions). Or they just don’t care anymore :frowning:

If the future of Forza Motorport is just Forza RC, then I’m probably jumping of the train soon (there are still the old Forza games to play). In order to Forza RC to become the thing T10 needs to fix and improve the multiplayer, that has been poor for years. Will that happen? At the moment I don’t believe so. I won’t be pre-ordering Forza Motorsport 8 for sure and never again will I buy car packs before I know their content. Horizon on the other hand has improved (so far) with every iteration in the series - hopefully that trend continues.

For me the overall situation isn’t even frustrating anymore (except the state of the multiplayer, which is annoying), but amusing and funny … or maybe ridiculous is the best word to use here. I’m just glad, that the whole crates thing faded away (probably thanks to EA) and we didn’t see, what plans they had with that gaming industry abomination.

T10 seriously needs to do a AMA, where they also answer to uncomfortable questions.

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To make matters worse is that when you strip most it back, it’s still Forza 6 with admittedly more cars and what, 3 more tracks… This is why I don’t understand all the issues. I’ve played Forza since inception but I can’t comprehend that the online portion of the game is tarnished with people just ramming in to others yet no implementation of a penalty system, While I’m at it, I’m going to list some of the gripes I have with the game because you’ve all got me fired up.

  • I don’t understand that when I’m in cockpit view and use RS to view left or right the whole landscape is on an angle.
  • The lap timers on HUD are better on any other racer. Take GT Sport for example. It shows splits, it shows time from car in front/behind. It shows lap times at all times… (arghhhh)
  • If I’m playing rivals and race the most car of the person I’m trying to beat and then beat that rival, a new rival appears - yay - but their ghost car doesn’t!!! Something that DriveClub and many others racers can do!!!

Enough for now.

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The lack of a penalty system doesn’t both me at all for general public hoppers. I think it would be a good idea to have class hoppers with a penalty system. At least a couple of the more popular classes to try out the system. Watching Super GT’s Gran Turismo videos, I’m not a fan of the GT system as the penalties seem to be inconsistent. Some of what I would consider to be good racing ends up being a BS 3-5 second penalty.

The one thing all hoppers need is to ghost any car that is down a lap or is about to be lapped by the leader. That will cure most of the troll headaches. They may be able to get us first corner, but anyone who has any decent racing experience will be able to spin the trolls and get away. Once away, the ghosting when they get lapped will take care of them.

Forza 6.5 would have been a better FM7 than what got released. The thing that really hurts FM7 online(aside from the performance issues) is the poor lap count and track rotations. When you have new tracks, never see them, with lap counts and track rotations inferior to FM6…it makes no sense to play FM7 online.

A couple of things are better online in FM7…

  • I’ve noticed no one person being able to lock up an entire lobby if they lag out. That is good.
  • The rain racing in FM7 is better than FM6, seems more realistic.

However I hate rain racing in general as it begs the question why race in the rain? It’s not like they can’t control the weather in the game…that is the ONLY reason, in real life, for racing in the rain…it can’t be helped. No sane real life racer has ever been like…Dude, we need some rain to make this race better!!!

I think rain for the Horizon series makes sense given the playground nature, but IMO, it has no place in the Motorsports series. Rain is generally a lobby killer.

Edit: I will take a step back and say rain would be okay for the single player part of Motorsports…to vary the experience…however not for online racing.

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You could not be more wrong about real racing drivers not wanting it to rain for a race.Some drivers love driving in the rain (Senna,Schmacher Hamilton) others are like you & dislike it.Obviously nobody likes it when the conditions are to wet with standing water & poor visibility.Some drivers have a car that is more competitive in the wet.I used to race at club level & enjoyed the rain.
Rain is actually implemented well in Forza 7,although the lap times should be a bit slower.A fully wet track should be approximately 10 secs a lap slower.Probably about 3-5 secs slower in F7.
If the online wet races suck it is probably due to the drivers.Most of them are terrible in the dry in F7 so as soon as the conditions are more difficult it amplifies just how bad they are.

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Lol. That made me think of what could be the reason behind that. While reading your post, I was sitting in a reclining couch. I rotated my head to the side in a natural/comfortable movement, and interestingly enough I noticed that the “landscape” (well, the walls of the room) appeared at an angle.

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The way this game is going reminds me alot of what has happened to the destiny franchise. The devs really didn’t listen to community feedback nor did they quickly resolve bugs and issues so now they have to deal with a dwindling fan base and still find ways to sell DLC.

The difference here is that Forza has alot of technical issues that have still not been addressed while Destiny has an identity issue.

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Oh bother, I actually agree with NightDriver on something.

To add to the valid points others have made about persistent bugs and a general lack of communication or interaction with the community about them; it is important to note that I’m sure there are factors influencing these issues that none of us can, or probably ever will, know. That said, the quality of the game has been allowed to flounder for far too long, and as a result a replacement of top level management of the studio is likely in order. It seems clear that those in charge either can’t get it together, or aren’t asking for the correct information to understand the full picture.

You can brag about initial units sold, total playtime, critic reviews, or stream views all you want, but when a number of those people are logging in just to see how badly the widebody kit accidentally added to a 1997 Civic is messed up, it isn’t helping future sales.

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I think the same way mate, I just wasn’t game to admit it. This just goes to show that no matter how we nitpick about details, our view of the big picture can be exactly the same.

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Remember when they delayed the patch because of an issue? hahahaha! Everyone joked about them finally testing their patches. Then it released and we were all wrong.

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I agree with this part of your post but not all of it.

You may speak for many of the players, (it is hard to tell exactly). But you certainly do not speak for all of us.
I do share many of your disappointments, but I have not lost trust or faith in Turn 10.

EDIT: I have gone back and reread your post more carefully. I find I agree with many of your points.