I certainly hope so, i hope its replaced with the current league system so long as its developed more. my main reasons for this is that leagues only match players with the same true skill and it gives you the chance to drive cars that are not as competitive as the others in that class. Just imagine if forza 6 had no public hoppers but in its place there were 10 or so leagues running each week. Covering all the classes but ranging from spec, cycled production, full pi and ghost. Some could be permanent leagues and some could change week by week.
So Is there a place in forza 7 for public hoppers ?
Does anyone agree that the league system should be developed more and be the main online experience in place of the public hoppers?
What I think should happen is that the ranking system should be beefed up to include an element of temperament, with a range of lobbies with different minimum scores required for entry, from free-for-all at one end that anyone can get into through to really hardcore at the other end that only the fastest and cleanest can get into, and these lobbies should be division-based and changed regularly like leagues are currently, rather than class-based.
What I think will happen is that FM7 will be almost identical to FM6 but with more cars.
If they implement what you suggested, I also hope they allow you to choose which “level” of lobby you enter, so if the hardest one to get into has very few people racing, you can go a level down.
The way I suggested it, anyone could enter any lobby they’ve qualified for, so even a super-elite driver could choose to race in the noob lobby if they wanted to, but a lvl 0 rammer couldn’t get into the higher ones.
Why would you want to? if anything having a much faster and skilled driver in a low lobby completely showing up how bad the lower skilled drivers wont make for better racing. it would just cause frustration and aggression to the person lapping everyone.
Plus its a bit unfair if a high skilled player enters a lower level lobby and then just dominates the points ? that’s what a hopper is for, not the league matches, where wins count for points.
You need both, don’t see why there wouldn’t be both. hoppers for just casual play and the league matches when racers what to get serious and be competitive.
I said why in the post he replied too, albeit not quite as extreme as that. If the top notch level has only 1 lobby with 8 people racing, you might want to go down 1-2 levels so there are some more people to race with.
I’m not suggesting making everything leagues, I’m suggesting taking the good elements of both leagues and hoppers and combining them (or taking the single semi-successful element of leagues and adding it to hoppers, then ditching leagues). Fast players would want to race in lobbies with low restrictions for the same reasons you find far more Pinnacle-level players in public hoppers than in leagues - because they want to play with their mates and they want to drive certain cars or classes or divisions and they don’t want their session arbitrarily cut short by pointless time windows, or whatever.
The Modern GT hopper, for example, is awesome and you’ll find waaaaaaay more fast guys playing that than any Pinnacle league. The spread of abilities is actually a good thing and suits the format. The only thing wrong with it is that, as it’s completely open, most lobbies have at least one moron. Splitting it up completely by rank would probably ruin it because the total number of players at each level isn’t enough to sustain it, but if it could be slightly restricted to keep out the level 0s and career griefers then it would be improved for players of all levels without ruining it.
That aside, anyone who doesn’t want faster drivers in their lobby is doing it wrong. You only get better by racing and learning from faster drivers. The way I look at it, if I’m the fastest guy in a lobby then I’m in the wrong lobby and I’ll go find a new one.
Whilst I would love to see a new online model in FM7 based on an improved league system I can’t see Turn 10 changing anytime soon. FM7 will probably be setup in roughly the same way as FM6 but maybe with the Forza Race Championship replacing leagues. When the Race Championship launches and we actually find out exactly what it is we could probably use it as an indication as to the direction Forza is going with their online mode.
If they were to change the hoppers to a skill based system I do see it having one problem though and that is the amount of people available to actually fill the lobbies at the highest level. One of the main problems with the current league system is that there is often not enough people playing in pinnacle to actually fill a lobby even with just two leagues available. For whatever reason a lot of the people who currently qualify for pinnacle don’t bother racing in the leagues.
Maybe some of you new Forza racers, that would like to try out the League racing, that is offered in the “Racers Lounge”
You would not have to depend upon Turn 10 to come up with something that you would enjoy racing in.
There are many Forza Racing Leagues being offered right now.
I think there’s room for both. I don’t think there is ever a reason to remove things from a game just because YOU personally don’t use them. Many people will want one feature, while just as many will require the opposite. Some people love leagues for it’s set of rules, other’s like pubbies to meet new people and add to their friends list. It’s all swings and roundabouts, but once a feature is present why spend more time removing it because some people don’t use it.
Forza is clearly being pushed into e-sports territory by Microsoft, so i’m sure by FM7 the leagues system will be vastly upgraded with various options and levels.
Unfortunately, I agree and suspect that Forza Motorsport 7 will end up going down the same route. We’ve been making suggestions on how to clean up the Multiplayer environment for months, years even, but given how Forza Motorsport 6 was handled Turn 10 seem to be pretty happy with letting the day-to-day Multiplayer experience be ruined by people who {a} cannot or {b} refuse to show respect for their competitors.
Forza Motorsport 7 is likely in the roadmap stages at Turn 10, where the key ideas and philosophies are being outlined. Now is the perfect time to let them know what you want to see in the upcoming game, and this is the thread to do it in. By the time they announce the game it’s already been “designed” and the chances for features to be changed/added is very low, so if you want a cleaner experience you can’t wait until the game is “nearly done” to tell them.
There is a faint glimmer of hope that we’ll see some minor features added in August when the Forza Racing Championship launches, considering they’ve already been making minor changes to circuits in recent months.
If the FRC just ends up being the current Hopper/League system with some prizes tacked on (ie: how the Super Trofeo was handled) then it’s pretty much pointless in my opinion. The way they’ve worded their announcement implies that it’s not going to be your run-of-the-mill Multiplayer experience, but there’s no point in getting one’s hopes up.
Personally I’m done with Forza Motorsport 6; the negative Hopper experience forced me out of the game back in April and the 1 hour I did last week showed me that there hasn’t been any improvement. If FRC doesn’t have a positive influence on the day-to-day Hopper experience then the game’s uninstalled for good.
Room for both yes, reasons to have both… well I’m struggling to see why a public hopper would be needed if the league system was improved and made bigger. Why would any 1 choose to race in an environment with no rules unless you was hell bent on causing anarchy. Those that do need to be made to race leagues and to suffer consequences for cutting, rammig etc. Scrapping publics and adopting a league system would clean this game up over night.
Organised racing is ok if you can keep to the scheduled but I have found that most people just want to turn there xbox on at a random time and find good clean racing. The hoppers are the first port of call for any newb that plays this game. Showing that newb a diffrent online experience may help to influence what road they take when deciding if there going to be a rammer or a racer. Before anyone says they come to the game with that mindset already that’s rubbish
It’s the can’t beat em join em mentality that produces a wrecker. Monkey does what monkey sees
All they need is Custom Public Lobbies. Will solve all the issues. Can race with who you want and host can kick whoever they want. That was the best system and it needs to come back.
I agree custom public hoppers are needed but you still need a good effort from the game. Unless you go down the road of battlefield and have nothing but user created servers. I like the idea of that but I don’t think it’s popular enough and most servers would be dead
I think you can have CPL’s and regular hoppers. Forza 4 it seemed to work. I believe Project Cars is all CPL’s and it works great. Very clean. Presumabley Forza 7 will be on PC as well and those guys are not gonna want to be in a random hopper. Either that or at the very least have truskill based hoppers so it at least matches skill level. People of varying skill level in a hopper just does not make sense.
I don’t see why there can’t be room for both. I actually don’t race in the leagues ever but I wouldn’t come here saying I hope they get rid of them.
I prefer the public lobbies because I don’t want to be restricted to racing specific car types and what not. I like to choose a car class and race what I want.
Public lobbies wouldn’t get so much hate if T10 implemented a proper system to discourage dirty racing. Imo iRacing currently has the best system for keeping things clean. I feel T10 should begin looking there to see how to get the job done right.
I would quite miss my A class hopper should it go. There’s something simplistic about Class hoppers, where you can take virtually any car you’d like and build it how you want and then race it against all sorts of other cars. This idea of being able to race anything against everything is a feature that has been a part of forza from the start, and really shouldn’t go.
Once you remove class based hoppers, and replace them with spec cars and cycled production, what’s the point of having upgrades in the game in the first place.
As cool as it may sound to race people of your equal skill, it would be a huge step backwards for the franchise
It just seems that the hoppers are disfunctional part of the game, it’s already been said that mixing all the diffrent skill levels together is hopeless. I belive if the league system was the only choice then everyone would step up there game to get promoted.
I can understand wanting to keep all the classes as hoppers but matching skill level is essential if the game is going to evolve
The game already uses TrueSkill to matchmake people in Hoppers (in addition to letting you join off of a friend). The issue is that the 5% of players who race clean are spread so thinly that you don’t get enough of them in a single Hopper Lobby to have an incident-free session.
Let’s break it down with some hypothetical numbers:
10,000 people are in the Hoppers right now.
10% of those are perfectly clean racers (1000).
There are roughly 20 different types of Hopper available, 1 for each Class and a few with car restrictions like Modern GT.
That cuts the number of potential clean racers in the Hopper you have chosen down to 50.
There are 500 total players in that Hopper’s player pool (including the clean racers).
Now, let’s assume that each Lobby in that Hopper has an average of 20 players. If that is the case and the averages hold up there are roughly 2 clean racers per lobby, and you might be one of them. If you’re lucky then you’re in a room with more, which means that there are several rooms with 1 or even no clean racers present.
Hopefully that makes the issue a little clearer but to sum up:
The current system does use TrueSkill.
There are several Lobbies per Hopper.
There are several Hoppers in Multiplayer.
The “clean racers” that match your skill level are spread so thinly that you might not come across a single one in a session.
There are some potential solutions to this:
Reduce the number of players that can fit into a lobby (unlikely as Turn 10 have heavily marketed 24 car multiplayer as the future of racing).
Reduce the number of Hoppers available (also unlikely as there are so many cars in the series that a 10+ level class system is needed to balance them all).
Increase the number of players who are online at any one time (somewhat out of Turn 10’s control as they both have to increase sales and convince more people to join the Multiplayer portion of their game).
If you want me to condense this even further, here’s a one-liner:
There aren’t enough people playing Forza online and the few that do are spread too far apart.