Agreed, just make the walls like they are on FM7. These stop you real quick. Luckily in most of my races there arent very many wallriders but it just takes 1 to ruin the fun. Stop making the game worse just because you want to cater to casual kids
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Recommend looking up many threads on it.
First is programming a game isnt like playing with lego. You cannot just plug whatever in and it will work. Just like you cannot just plop whatever engine into a car you want despite how casual game make it.
Next is that over and over again it has been said that it is being worked on but it isnt a magic wand. Wallriding and other multiplayer changes in works with them starting rollout on the revamps in season 5 as has been also stated.
Honestly this could be fixed within minutes. It would be pretty easy. A quick and dirty fix would be to cancel players velocity up9n collison detection with the walls mesh. Probably 3 lines of code, 1 check players position, 2 if in wall hitbox change players velocity to 0, 3 check players position again once they clear the hitbox. I could code this in almost any language within 10 minutes. There are more elegant solutions (which i imagine they are testing), but those would take longer.
Yes they could fix this in a simple 10kb hotfix, they wont because game developers like to spread out fixes and changes to “feature” bugs as a way to entice players to stay active. The ones who wall ride will continue, the ones who dont will keep playing cause the devs promise change. Just dont kid yourself that they are limited by technology, because they could very easily make a change. MMO’s do this all the time. Wall riding is just the flavor of the month metagame that everyone should be abusing. Once the feature gets changed, then some new meta will take over like the Bone Shaker.
It is easier for PG to keep both groups of people playing with nothing but a promise if future changes, then to lose the wall riding players by taking action.
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phantom hes just commenting to comment did the same on my post. has no clue what hes even talking about prolly just trolling
It is not trolling. It is more complex than that. It needs situational analysis to not create an exploitable and worse gameplay. Specially for a racing game. They implement that and you know what? Rammers paradise!
You think wallriding is bad, then imagine you losing all velocity because somebody bumped you into the wall. There is a huge difference between motorsports and horizon race courses and not just the weather and track surface. Horizon wall riding is bad because there is no runoff space. Leave road and is a house or tree, so wall is right on track.
So if you just do the friction or zero v. I tell you right now top of leaderboard will be there because they start shanking peeps into walls. It is a worse prospect than wall riding. Horizon will always have the walls and it needs the walls to balance the play to all the majority of non rank competitive peeps.
How many play rank vs not? We dont have those numbers, but PG definitely factors that in. Murderwalls would harm the majority casual player base more than wallriding does the competitive ranked minority.
So go ahead with an imbalanced farmer fix without consideration of larger ramification and reasoning. Many games have died in the past for that. It devastated some of my favorites. Eve online and crossout most prominently. The easy fix or sounds cool pretty much driving off most players.
So as such, the fix for ramming and wallriding will not be in a single line of code. It will be a complex logics system so as to not make it even worse for serious techical drivers. With walls as they are, technical drivers at least can stay in a point of contention. Make walls brakes or removing walls now means dirty drivers WILL take you out of contention completely.
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Will they simulate the friction coeffiecent for every type of wall and car material? Would a car going 200mph weigh 1800lbs made of carbon fiber have the same friction coeffiecent as a car going the same speed made of steel, or fiberglass? What happens when it rains? If you are in a car, and hit a wall, or ride up against it, you slow down. You lose velocity (speed), the friction transfers your kinectic energy into heat and the loss of your kinectic energy makes you lose velocity. You will learn about this in senior year. Friction isnt even a fundemental force.
No wonder why PG never talks to their community.
Not sure if the disrespect was towards me. It seemed like the beginning you were agreeing then dropped the respectability at the end cause it definitely seemed that way.
Yeah, and friction isnt a static value. The amount of force tangent to the surface with the coefficient of friction is what determines the maximum longitudinal force. So for a game, nobody would notice if all cars had same coefficient of friction.
But this is a lead into why it isnt just a slow down. How do you do it? Easiest way is to fudge in some sort of braking value, but then having to apply and balance it onto the side surface of the vehicle to maintain correct dynamics. There already is a lot involved with collisions and scraping walls but the high power cars can brute force past that. So in a way, if you bring realism into it, the walls are already acting sorta correct. Ever see the cars run on the wall in a crash on a circle track? A hard barrier doesnt slow you down with friction.
Something else should have learned. Mechanical friction tends to be less, and can be a lot less. Is why you accelerate slower when spinning tires… Huh… How about that.
Difference is, when a car hits a wall, it is toast. Something called damage. In nascar for example, even a light brush can take out your tires.
Now a crushable or tire barrier is different because it effectively catches a vehicle. It isnt friction that is stopping it.
So now back to fh4? Where is the easy one line of code that wont just trash the play experience and make it generally worse for everybody from multiplay rank to solo? There just isnt. I can see some physics tweak. Maybe in long future there will be crushable barriers. But for now, just a penalty system, while more work, would be the best solution and also protect clean racers from being expoited by being pushed into wall.
Any mechanical system made more extreme than it is will make ramming all the more meta. In the turn heavy courses with lots of walls, it will be a big wreckfest and pushing peeps off will be more meta. It didnt solve it in FM7, it definitely wont solve it here. And increased friction would need to be ludicrously dumb to counter wall riding in fh4
Isn’t it easy to code some 2 or 4 seconds speed decreasing penalty for a player riding the whole wall ?
I guess automatic detecting a wall ride is not that hard.
Well, even then is a complex one. Some of the major offenders are rather quick corners, ride for a second. Then needing to compare with non wall ride hits. Lastly balancing with the type of game.
Make no mistake. Horizons will not be a dedicated simulator. It is not Motorsports 7 nor do they want it to compete. All the marketing is as an enthusiasts game. So the racing style will be more arcadey… That means and it is expected that a younger and more casual market. Combined with tightet boundaries, hitting walls will be a thing with considerations as to how bad the cost will be.
In most cases, you already lost speed from the hit, and time from the bad line. But tail slappings on exits or such are short with bad turns being slow from braking and long in duration.
So now it is more complex. One would need to add your speed into the variable, and then power of car for overcoming resistance etc so there isnt an advantage if just heavy large displacement v10 in anything goes.
Factor in observation time to determing the problem, coding, testing and balancing for everything from D100 to X999, vans to konigs and a few months isnt that big expecially for proper implementation.
Edit: so then how does one determing if it is a wallride? Speed? Distance? Do they go into every single track and edit the wall object to have flaggables and then a counters system to trip which ince more, eventually will be figured out and rectify nothing?
Maybe a bit more friction while touching the wall ?
Would be only a bit more realistic but still keep arcade style and prevent us from getting overtaken by Asphalt 8 players 
Yup, and that why it will take a little bit more time. There are multiple issues with the multiplayer, so work on them in concert to ensure that when the change comes, it will be decent for all parties without unintentional negative side effects.
But main thing is they have said in stream that the changes are coming and from what was said, can be expected fairly soon from a development timeframe.
source: Forza Horizon 4 - Darius's Twin Turbo Audi R8 for S1-Class [Ranked Adventure] - YouTube
this is just one example, the driver did his wallride thing multiple times in this race, if you want to know, watch the whole race Forza Horizon 4 - Darius's Twin Turbo Audi R8 for S1-Class [Ranked Adventure] - YouTube
can we please fix this already? Thank you!
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I think the Horizon franchise is aimed at non serious racers, casual players and shouldn’t be taken too seriously regarding wallriders - this is where they are expected to go and crash and have fun.
For fun, non experienced racers need walls to keep them within the race otherwise it is not fun for them and those players make up a huge percentage of the sales for the game.
So what if they win sometimes? Play the game and cheat too!
Other aspects of this game suggest fun, ridiculous jumps, team racing, crash and burn environment - why would anyone expect it to also have strict serious racing?
Motorsport is where the seriousness belongs, this is why I don’t play motorsport titles - I`m not good enough nor interested enough in serious racing and politics in a virtual world.
Serious players should stick to motorsport and avoid a game aimed at the other side rather than try to change it to be another serious motorsport game.
Honestly if Horizon became that serious I may as well buy motorsport and crash into those walls too!
As it is I like the crash burn fun aspect of going nuts in an overpowered car, many players here do - its a fantasy world.
I realize motorsport has similar issues, the complaints and fixes should be directed there and let the inexperienced / kids / casuals / cheaters etc have somewhere to go and have fun - that’s the whole point of having 2 titles to support 2 major player bases.
As a casual poor driver I only buy the title that suits me (horizon)
As a serious player with high expectations you should know where you belong. (or buy both titles and accept them for what they are - different)
Does anyone go to the motorsport forum and demand danger signs and freeroam to be added between races? It would make as much sense as coming to the Horizon forum and demanding serious racing conditions.
Just my opinion as a paying customer.
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Imo wallriding in current state dont fit in any forza style, forza is after all balancing between realism and arcade and right now wallriding is more ridicolus level than some arcade games. And i wouldnt say even motorsport in that serious racing game. And as PG state allready after few weeks game lauch that they are not happy current mp, and later streams they have say there is gonna be fixes abaout wallriding so it seems that even PG thinks that this level of wallriding dont fit in even in horizon.
“non experienced racers need walls to keep them within the race” No, they need breaks to keep them in the race.
Or do you really think that horizon should be somethink that only noobs, kids and cheaters can enjoy and PG should ignore all those players who are long time forza players?
Honestly i couldnt care less how arcade they would make team multiplayer lets add nitros, polices, takedowns, collapsing buildings, shortcuts, wallriding, ramming and every other aspect that can ever imagine in most arcade game as long that solo multiplayer would offer better online experience for me and everybody else who is looking clean racing where you cant win by wallriding and ramming.
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Found the wallrider. Btw Forza 7 walls slow you down so being a cheap wallrider will slow you right down. Maybe we should have community maps for all the people who want everything to be easy?
Like a 10 meter wide track with walls everywhere, that should be perfect for you guys. All 12yr olds can drive on walls like a train
“non experienced racers need walls to keep them within the race” No, they need breaks to keep them in the race.
Or do you really think that horizon should be somethink that only noobs, kids and cheaters can enjoy and PG should ignore all those players who are long time forza players?
Yes and No.
Non experienced players have no braking skill, once they learn to take a line and brake as required they would be considered experienced. In the meantime they do lean on walls a lot to remain in the race.
Just consider if little johnny cant ride the wall and looses all the time he will put the game away in a tantrum and play something else, if thousands of kids stopped playing horizon its possible sales would go down to the point they abandoned the title over a few releases.
I agree whole heartedly that Motorsport should address all issues with this as it is more of a race simulator aimed at an adult or at least matured racing enthusiast, but in horizon it is a fantasy smash up derby, it may be aimed at kids who are several years from learning how to drive in real life, it is a game after all, i think we need to accept the kids may want to play video games and us dads may need to let them learn regardless of how poor they perform.
The long term players should really accept horizon as a fun game and not be so competitive, maybe relax and play smash up with the kids and maybe even teach them a thing or 2.
How could anyone take a racing game this seriously if the driver is wearing a chicken suit and the majority of players are under 12?
I have start play racing games way before i learn to drive real car and yet still i learn to use breaks and have really fun playing games like colin mcrae rally. And god please dont call motorsport as a simulator because is not even close to be simulator.
Do you really thing that little johnny need to be winning in online if dont know even how to use brakes? And no, even horizon is not made just for little kids who have never play car games before. And you argument that if little johnnys cant win in online when have zero driving skills they will leave game, and you except that more exprience players dont leave the game if online is somethink like that where even my cat can win in online races?
Majority of players are under 12, i would really like to know how you end up with that number? If we take all gaming avarage of player is over 30 and player who are under 18 are only abaout 20% of all players and you argument that majority of fh4 players are under 12, no im not buying that.
So in that i can easily end up that majority of players are over 12 and they should know how to break, or if they dont know they are old enough to learn braking. And as i say earlier it seems that wallriding in current state isnt something that PG want to see even tho it seems to take really long time do anything abaout it. So maybe you need to also learn whitch button you need to press before corner when you cant wallride anymore.
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I only said the majority of players are kids due to hearing them using a mic from FH3, it was rare to hear an adult or a mature kid, I have not heard anything in FH4 because the mics don’t work anymore but I assume a similar player base.
Maybe on a different time zone there is more adults but I have never heard them when I play. Maybe I am wrong, I am not arguing it.
But yes those little whinny kids you hear in world do request the game as a xmas gift and do tend to overpower cars, drive Lambos in cross country and in general be kids.
Very few of them have a goal to learn to drive competitively.
I am not a kid myself, I am also not a gamer, but I do love my cars.
I did buy my son a PS1 many years ago with gran turismo. I do remember in that game you needed to gain a license to qualify for the races before you could compete even though it wasn’t online…
Perhaps that may be the answer for this game? no skills = limited license, engine / HP restrictions, restrictions to A class or lower.
As your skills increase your license allows you more power to race with the big boys… just a thought.
Wallriding crash-kids or bad drivers aren’t the problem. They are slow enough everywhere they can’t wallride so they gonna lose anyway. The problem occurs when decent to fast players use wallrides. On an equal skill level practiced wallriding is always faster than clean driving. Thus, many fast players make use of this advantage and it’s impossible to keep up when driving clean.
I don’t care about “Little Johnny” who rides the walls in his poorly built Skyline and fails in the next turn or straight or whatever.
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Wow there are actually people here justifying wallriding. Arcade racer or not, wallriding is not racing! Its basically like cheating and everyone that says its okay problably suck themselves. Even ModNation racers wont let you wallride and thats an extremely arcade racer aimed for kids. [Mod Edit - Abbreviated profanity, profanity and profanity that is disguised but still alludes to the words are not permitted - D]. If it was up to me i would ban every little wallrider kid, would clean up alot of TRASH
Any wallrider i see going to 1st place ima make sure to make the rest of their adventure hell.
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