https://www.greenmangaming.com/newsroom/2017/10/12/loot-boxes-not-gambling-says-esrb/
Well… There you have it. The ESRB (Entertainment Software Rating Board) have stated that they don’t consider loot boxes gambling… And there is the fact we don’t even have to buy them with real money either, so can we finally put this one to bed?
We’re people actually comparing this to gambling? I would have more sympathy to this idea if you could actually use real money to buy loot boxes, but we’re using monopoly money.
Yep. The ESRB were obviously talking about paid loot crates, but if THEY aren’t considered gambling, then how could Forza crates be considered gambling, even once they’re made available to buy via tokens? We’ll still have the option to buy them with credits, and so far no-one has proven that there are locked cars within them, making it essentially unnecessary and not a hindrance if you choose not to buy them.
How is this even a point of conversation? Gambling really?
It was used as evidence by some who hated loot crates.
Hate loot crates? Don’t buy loot crates! Problem solved.
Lol I know. I don’t mind them. Great way to blow credits.
Apparently, it is easier to complain about the game than it is to play it…
Loot crates don’t bother me. I think they should cost a lot less by hey… it is what it is
Same here lol. I bought the cheapest one just to try it and got a bunch of stuff that didn’t even come close to the value of $20k i paid. Why would I ever buy loot crates when I could buy CARS.
I bought a 300k credit loot crate, just for the hell of it. Got an 850k credit car. It worked out pretty well that time, lol.
The bonus credits achieved with the mods make the crates worth it. If you buy the cheapest one then you won’t get much value back But if you but the premium boxes you get better cards.
Eg the premium box (50,000) gives you 5 cards with 60-70% credits, each of them can be used 3x. In a typical race of around 15,000 credits this would give you a bonus of 150,000 over 5 races , the crate only cost 50,000. You can take more advantage of them by doing longer races, were the return could be well over 500.000.
It is definitely faster to earn money by using the crates.
The only gambling in FM7 is do I shoot up the middle or take the outside route to the first corner of every race to avoid the demolition derby.
That comment bro! hahaha
Hahaha, no this isn’t gambling. At least in gambling you have a chance of winning. You know you have no chance in that first corner… it’s just how bad will it be.
Edit: original comment not relevant.
Excellent explanation by Hieronymus1967 a few posts down from here in post #13
Prize Crates are here to stay.
Tokens are (eventually) here to stay.
The only way they will not be included in future titles is if global player data for a game indicated that they are either {a} not used or {b} cost more in development/maintenance than they bring in in revenue.
You, me and the rest of this forum’s userbase as individuals cannot change this process, as the game is likely going to be played by a few million people.
All you can really do about a feature you don’t like (other than to post or email about your preferences) is to simply not use it, and hope that a significant portion of the overall playerbase agrees with you.
While feedback is useful and important for publishers to see, data is the ultimate decider.
It never really was gambling but a simulated gambling-like mechanic.
Legally, gambling requires three elements, Consideration, Chance, and Prize.
With these loot crates, there is no consideration so long as they are purchased with in-game currency in the form of credits. Even if you were to purchase tokens with real fiat money and use those tokens to purchase loot crates, there would still be no inherent consideration as the item you’ve purchased, the tokens themselves or the crates purchased with them, have no cash value outside the game mechanic. Credits, tokens, crates are non-transferrable and non-refundable. They are game creations that only exist within the game itself.
There is no real chance where there is no chance to come up entirely empty-handed. There are no entirely empty loot crates, and everyone is guaranteed to collect something from each purchase. These loot crates are no different than collecting baseball cards or similar cards in this respect, you might not win what you’re hoping for in your blind purchase but you never open an empty pack with nothing in it.
There is no real prize to win as the loot boxes only provide you with in-game items that again, have absolutely no value outside the game itself. The credits and tokens have no value outside the game and the items you can win through your loot crate purchases, cars, suits, badges, mod cards, have no value outside the game either because all these items are non-transferrable.
No one but publishers like loot crates but trying to get them removed by claiming they are somehow gambling really doesn’t work.
I work on a major collectible card game, and the Prize Crates are almost exactly of the same structure as booster packs. Multiple pack types, multiple price points, multiple rarities etc., all the same.
Trading card game booster packs had the same gambling concerns levied at them in the past, and the consensus was that since you’re guaranteed to get something in every pack they are not considered gambling. You may not get the cards you want all the time, but you will get something.
The only real difference is that the Prize Crate rewards are non-transferable to other humans, but at the very least you can sell content back to the game for a CR reward.
I got some Legendary Driver Gears from 2 successive Prize Crates last night, and since the second was a duplicate of the first I sold it back to the game for 200,000 CR.
Personally I’m not going to splurge all my CR into packs, and I’ll disable the Tokens feature the moment it is added to the game, but if I have a few million CR and no cars I immediately want to buy then I’ll get a crate for fun. No harm in that, opening packs is fun even if you don’t always get what you want.
I think the assessment is correct but I also think there’s gambling-like parts to it.
It doesn’t change the fact that most people hate them and that usually they’re a greedy thing added by publishers/developers. Maybe real money won’t be needed for them in Forza 7 but looking at how they’ve been utilised in other games, I’m wary of them in any game.
Even if they couldn’t be bought with real money I still think they’ve negatively impacted FM7. The addition of driver suits and removal of bonuses for turning off assists are almost certainly the result of their implementation.