Actually, there are a lot of parallels between the Office software and FH4. Excel in particular has some really basic functionality that has been absent for decades, and instead of adding these basic features that would really help people like me who use it a lot for our work, they make cosmetic changes like the ribbon.
They don’t care. It is plain to see. They think they made a brilliant game. They get rewards and laurels for it. For the Forza faithful they screwed up yet another Forza and like Forza 7 it will take them yrs to do all of these things if they ever do. The Horizon we knew is dead and never coming back most likely. Story mode, daily challenges, the whole season thing is all designed to make you keep coming back to play the game. That is all this game is. In case you guys have not noticed this is no longer a game about racing. RIP Horizon
I don’t think it is that they don’t care actually. I think it is more that they don’t care about the players on this forum. RetroKrystal just told us we are the least active community they watch so why would this group matter to them? The reality is that the players who built the fanbase and franchise into literally genre defining position are no longer the target audience. Many of us on this forum are outside the age range of who these games are now being marketed to. Maybe the games are going downhill and maybe we are just wanting quality that is unrealistic? Maybe it’s a money thing and we just refuse to spend our hard earned money stupidly while others don’t care so much and will keep buying junk? Either way, WE are no longer the developers priority.
The target is battle royale players and this game is designed with that in mind. Our suggestions will never be implemented and our complaints will never be addressed because at the end of the day, this game is exactly what they wanted it to be. It just isn’t what we wanted it to be. This is twice now that Forza has been an utter disappointment due to a whole new direction of the game and I will certainly not be back for a third. I had FM7 refunded after launch and as a consequence of that game, I did not even think about FH4. I only started playing it because it was on gamepass and I’m happy with that I didn’t pay for it.
We have already been told there is no FM8 in the pipeline, they aren’t even working on it at a point where we are normally just over six months away from release time. They have been pouring all of their time into completely rebuilding FM7 because it was THAT bad at launch. I believe we have seen the last of the yearly releases for the franchise as well as the last of the two separate lines. I am thinking that the next iteration of Forza will be FM and FH combined into some weird vehicle battle game with mounted guns and rocket launchers, replete with 1000+ car/weapon ‘skins’ and clothes you can win (or just go ahead and buy for only $.99 each!) to appeal to the masses of casual gamer fans, but with the stunning visual vehicle graphics that FM is known for. And that is their right. It just blows.
As for RetroKrystal, She’s stuck between a rock and a hard place and we shouldn’t be too hard on her (and certainly not mean or insulting to her like some of you folks have been) because she is just doing her job. Whether or not she has info that she could share with us, she may also have clear instructions about what she can or cannot say. I’m not saying that I agree with a policy of secrecy towards ones customers, I actually feel strongly that 95% of the issues here could be eased with a large increase in communication, I’m just saying that I bet she is doing the best she can within the parameters of her job.
However, I totally understand the frustration and ill will and anger as for many of us, these games are a part of our lives. Forza was for many years how I unwound after work, which is EXTREMELY stressful. (Thank God for Witcher 3 this last year!) Countless hours in the AH and grinding seasons out in FM. The music in FM2 is still amazing. But all good things must end and what was once a large part of our lives is coming to be only a memory. Don’t be angry and bitter and allow those feelings to cloud that memory of Forza. Just put the franchise behind you find something new to enjoy. The fact is that this is a broken game (and broken development studio) in some of the players opinions and a perfect game in some players opinions, and PG has let us know over the last six months that we on this forum are in the group that is not as important to them. And as part of the very apparently less important group, I will return that loyalty and replace Forza with something else that will become more important.
Maybe you’re right. It’s happened before with other franchises I was heavily into. I put vast amounts of time into Call of Duty multiplayer from the first Modern Warfare to the third, with Black Ops in-between. But then for various reasons they dropped the ball and Call of Duty is now a shadow of what it once was, and is basically no longer relevant. I moved to Battlefield. BF3 and BF4 were the pinnacle and it’s gone downhill since too. BF4 is a good case in point for what a developer CAN do when they WANT to. It released with loads of problems and was widely condemned. The developers worked hard, worked fast and turned it around to make it the best in the series, and it still is to most players.
The industry is littered with developers who got complacent or lazy. I hope PG and Turn 10 don’t make that mistake. But it doesn’t look too encouraging at the moment.
Maybe it tends to be cyclical. Developers start out hungry for success, they make a ton of money, then the hunger and drive dissipates and the games become stale or die. And it needs some new blood with the hunger again to innovate and satisfy the market.
I’m with you. I used to love COD but completely lost interest in that series years ago. I started playing Battlefield instead and that was my go to shooter but I don’t like that franchise anymore either. Of course with BF I think it has more to do with the time periods they have gone to then anything else. The weapons back then weren’t nearly as smooth to handle as modern weapons so I have a hard time with them and get frustrated when I miss easy kills. Anyway I’m rambling and I guess I’m just too old school for today’s gaming.
Choice is the deciding factor in everything for me. While I can’t stand the current multiplayer format in H4 I think choice would get me to reinstall it and play it again. Add vote for class adventure or something. Add collisions off racing. Give me the choose of car class. Let me choose if I want free roam rush or not. I miss the lobby system games used to have because it was all about choice! Don’t like a certain mode, race type, car class, etc? No problem. You can pick something you do enjoy! Why this system has been buried boggles my mind and I’ve yet to here anyone explain why it’s gone. Seriously does anyone know?
I agree about Battlefield, once you get used to the modern stuff in 3 and 4, going back to WW1 and 2 era just doesn’t work for me. It’s like developers have a great product on their hands but don’t understand quite why it’s popular, so they foolishly mess with a winning formula like when Coca Cola changed their recipe that time, and then they seem surprised when it isn’t as popular.
I assume the lobby system was simplified due to the game’s increasingly casual focus? However, it has to be considered a failure when even Retro Krystal said she doesn’t play online much because she isn’t very good. Surely a casual friendly game would cater to her. That it doesn’t, means it isn’t for casuals., as the player numbers in ranked mode bears out, it’s mostly dedicated / hardcore types.
My thoughts as well with BF. It seems the only guns that fire smoothly in the WW eras are snipers and single shot rifles. Not my cup of tea as these weapons are much more geared for camping which I can not do. Yawn fest.
That could be it. I always thought that using the lobby system was very easy as long as things are labeled properly. When I was new to online gaming I had no problem understanding and getting into games that used the lobby setup. I don’t know what the trade off is here to make long term Forza players happy and keep the casuals engaged. I know what we have right now from a multiplayer standpoint is not for me. I can’t “adapt” to this kind of racing. It’s just not in me to push others off the track, checkpoint people and wall ride. If I take a turn bad and start heading towards the wall I’m still jamming the brakes down to try and avoid it as much as possible.
I just don’t have it in me to “go with it” and grind down the wall. You can’t do that in this game though because the chaos behind you will mash you into that wall instantly. In H3 I got good at avoiding the corner bombing by staying on the inside of sharp turns and breaking early. Can’t do that on 4 either as people are constantly trying to squeeze by in areas where there is no space to pass. This is just how this game is now and casuals think it’s great. I had to control myself by not going crazy on Twitter to a comment when Fortune Island released. Dude said. “This looks awesome. I can’t wait to push people off the mountain.” Sigh.
Maybe it was sarcasm.
The Xbox app says I’ve played the game for 668 hours now, and even that is nowhere near enough to get decent at ranked play, i.e. to have an optimised set of cars ready and know every course and the entire map. I’m disappointed to have to do it, as before FH4 I’d been focusing on getting my reward points up, and this is the first Forza game I’ve really felt able to make a good effort at getting to grips with, but I think I’m going to have to give up on it. I have time to test maybe 2 cars a week for one class and discipline combination, and even then it’s entirely possible I’ll fail to get the best out of a car. It’s just too much work to get anywhere. There’s the map and all the tracks to learn on top of that, it just doesn’t feel achievable. So I think I’ll settle for just slowly working my way through the rivals, maybe doing one a week, that alone will pretty much keep me busy for the lifespan of the game. So yes, it’s for dedicated/hardcore types only, which I think basically means people who don’t have a job and can play the game for 100 hours a week or something. Either that or people who are able to instantly memorise every detail of a track after driving it just once, and perfectly recall it weeks later.
Perhaps but I’m more inclined to think this is a fun way to play for a lot of players based off my online experiences. One less player to worry about beating if you launch them off a mountain.
That’s depend mutch in person also, you need to get possible car and need to know track really well to get decent online experience (at least this is image i get on your post) I have time to play more than 100 hours per week and i know most of tracks pretty well but online dont give any kinda decent experience. Sure if you want get really high rank you need to get decent numbers of good cars/tunes and need to remember tracks well but same goes every game where is ranked you need to spent lots of time to really be competive.
For me FH3 online was mutch more enjoyable, you could get some good tight racing without ramming and wallriding (yes there was ramming also but not nearly as mutch than in FH4) and i think FH3 style was also mutch more easier to casual players to jump in and have fun online experience.
Edit: I agree what you said on previous post, those changes allready would make online exprience mutch better in both hardcore player as casual players.
Xbox app says I’ve played 1365 hours lol. I live alone, no kids, I do have a job and I also play nearly 100 hours a week BUT its the only game I play. I do have a set of cars I use per class for specific seasons. I dont instantly memorize the races but i’ve definitely memorized routes for those freeroams lol. I’m probably the exception to others who play. I guess the amount of time i’ve spent playing does make me a hardcore type and I noticed patterns very quickly.
Races are controlled chaos, you may be able to avoid the pileups but only for so long. Freeroam is a different type of race without a set route, so I can find my own way away from the chaos. Its so rare you can find a clean lobby, it can discourage you from doing ranked. Either you have to have others in the lobby with a rank close to yours or higher for it to even be worth your time. Who wants to race for 20+ mins to finish with +0. The biggest gains will be made from rooms that stay full until the last race. When people drop off, thats less rank for you to win and lately i’ve been losing rank if I even finish 3rd. How crazy is that? Top 2 or bust
I think what would make it accessible to casual gamers is actually what so many of the more hardcore people have been asking for:
- Remove freeroam rush (fine if they want to keep it as its own discipline) - removes the need to learn the map
- Allow choice of class and discipline - means you only need one car and only have that subset of the tracks to learn
- Allow the option of ghost racing - reduces the amount of track learning needed, as you can always follow the best line, and don’t need to learn how to take each bend in different ways depending on other vehicles
- Eliminate wallriding and corner bombing - it takes a lot of time to learn how to do these best on every track
If they did all that, I’d probably feel able to become competent at racing a single class and discipline. This is all stuff that many people have already asked for, but I don’t think it has been appreciated just how much those things would reduce the amount of car development and track learning needed and hence make online racing more accessible to people with fewer hours per week available to play the game.
I don’t want you think that we don’t care, because everyone is just as important as each other. Just because you’re not as active, doesn’t mean that I don’t take into consideration what each of you say.
Alot of the feedback I’ve received here has resulted in further actions or changes and I hope I can slowly improve this for you all. This thread itself has given relevant information which I have passed on.
Do you care to share what other places are more active than this one? I’d like to go there and voice my concerns. I hope its Twitter because i’m always on there
I think you’ve contacted me on all forms of socials before? Even including my personal Xbox account.
Depends on your concern or information you’re requesting, the best way would be a suggestion & feedback ticket so I can pass this concern or feedback onto the team. Twitter is good for reminders and instant knowledge and also has a bigger base. Reddits quite good regarding photography and liveries or advice/help on aspects on the game. Other websites can vary but I’ve heard GTPlanet is good or Resetera. Or overall you could always DM but i’d probably direct to the support page.
I will covering most of them to hopefully reply and respond to as much as I can
Hope that helps
Yeah I follow you and Nitro. That really does help keep me up to date on the details of updates. I see it on twitter before I see it here. Was just curious if any other sites I should be visiting.
I don’t know if they don’t care or if the remaining team is just too small to simultaneously provide the “live service” stuff (seasonal events, rewards, expansion) and tackle improvements. I hope this whole “games as a service” strategy dies off quickly and we’ll get fully tested games at launch. In the context of “games as a service” the quality at launch rapidly decreased because of a “well, we can fix this later”-mentality. Forza 7, Horizon 4, Fallout 76, Battlefield 5, Star Wars Battlefront 2, recently Anthem.
All unfinished and barely tested crap at launch.
And horizon 4 seems to forgot that “fix later” part. In this point devs should allready know what they have done wrong and should be fixing those things instead of “listening to feedback and discussion things”. Just imagine if EA would launch game with this bad MP and they wouldnt make any changes 6 months, i think internet propobly would explode in that point. And lack of PG communicate with players just make things worst.