CW's Tuning Suspension and Anti Roll Bar

[aka_John_Caesar]

Hey folks how’s it going, I have for you two very simple very easy techniques for to set your car’s with a good strong balanced setup regarding your ARB’s and suspension.

WHAT YOU WILL NEED

The cars weight, the cars distribution (front %) and a scientific calculator or your phone (just for the % button).

You can find the front when you press up on the D pad from the cars build section where all the cars stats are shown.

ANTI ROLL BARS

This is the simplest technique of the two, The maximum number you can have on your ARB’s in the Forza is 40.0 front and rear.

So example if your car has a 50% front spilt (50% of the cars overall wieght) then you will type in to your calculator 40 - 50% which will = 20 as your ARB front value, this will obviously leave 50% left on the rear which will also result as 20 your rear ARB Value.

Now if you have a split of 43% front your Rear will of course be 57%, so you use exactly the same method. The % Front shown in game will almost always work out your front ARB then you would use the remaining % to work out the rear, so like I said if the front is 43% the remainder is 57% (always work it as 100% overall).
In some case you can try invert your results to change the cars behaviour. This can work well on AWD types

SUSPENSION SETUP

With suspension we use basically the same method but with an added difference. So for this we need to include the cars weight aswell.

So if the car weights 3,000 lbs and has a front of 50% it will have an even split front and rear there for you’ll have 1,500 lbs Front and Rear, since the 1,500 has to be split between both wheels at the front and rear you then simply devide the 1,500 by 2 which will give you 750 lbs (in game front suspension represents 1 wheel as does the rear).

This is how it should look on your calculator working a 50% 3,000 - 50% = 1,500 ÷ 2 = 750

When working with any front % value the game gives you, it will always equal your cars Rear value. Ie if you take away 43% of the cars overall wieght it will equal to the 57% left over (Rear value now divide by 2), likewise if you take away 57% of the cars overall wieght it will equal the 43% left over (Front value now divide by 2).

Again as with the ARB’s you can invert these result (swap them around) to change the cars behaviour.

Hope this helps you out, and please feel free to leave feed back, happy tuning Folks.

Questions???
You can get hold of me at any of the following.
XBL xCaesars Wrathx
My Twitter
My twitch channel

[aka_John_Caesar]

Bump it up.

[About500Rabbits]

@xCaesars Wrathx

Hey folks how’s it going, I have for you two very simple very easy techniques for to set your car’s with a good strong balanced setup regarding your ARB’s and suspension.

WHAT YOU WILL NEED

The cars weight, the cars distribution (front %) and a scientific calculator or your phone (just for the % button).

You can find the front when you press up on the D pad from the cars build section where all the cars stats are shown.

ANTI ROLL BARS

This is the simplest technique of the two, The maximum number you can have on your ARB’s in the Forza is 40.0 front and rear.

So example if your car has a 50% front spilt (50% of the cars overall wieght) then you will type in to your calculator 40 - 50% which will = 20 as your ARB front value, this will obviously leave 50% left on the rear which will also result as 20 your rear ARB Value.

Now if you have a split of 43% front your Rear will of course be 57%, so you use exactly the same method. The % Front shown in game will almost always work out your front ARB then you would use the remaining % to work out the rear, so like I said if the front is 43% the remainder is 57% (always work it as 100% overall).
In some case you can try invert your results to change the cars behaviour. This can work well on AWD types

SUSPENSION SETUP

With suspension we use basically the same method but with an added difference. So for this we need to include the cars weight aswell.

So if the car weights 3,000 lbs and has a front of 50% it will have an even split front and rear there for you’ll have 1,500 lbs Front and Rear, since the 1,500 has to be split between both wheels at the front and rear you then simply devide the 1,500 by 2 which will give you 750 lbs (in game front suspension represents 1 wheel as does the rear).

This is how it should look on your calculator working a 50% 3,000 - 50% = 1,500 ÷ 2 = 750

When working with any front % value the game gives you, it will always equal your cars Rear value. Ie if you take away 43% of the cars overall wieght it will equal to the 57% left over (Rear value now divide by 2), likewise if you take away 57% of the cars overall wieght it will equal the 43% left over (Front value now divide by 2).

Again as with the ARB’s you can invert these result (swap them around) to change the cars behaviour.

Hope this helps you out, and please feel free to leave feed back, happy tuning Folks.

Questions???
You can get hold of me at any of the following.
XBL xCaesars Wrathx
My Twitter
My twitch channel

I’m sorry but I’m completely lost here. Why are you using the weight per corner as the basis for your total suspension stiffness?? I know it’s a simple method but in my experience it’s over sprung the lighter cars.

I Don’t understand the method behind the roll bars either because the softest you can set them to is 1 giving you a range of 39 not 40. I know you’re giving it as an example and you’re just giving the example to show the way you “balance” the car but I’m just a touch confused by the results because the resulting ARB stiffness doesn’t vary by spring stiffness or damping which has an effect on roll too. It looks like it’s giving the results based on idealistic balance instead of actual balance.

It’s good that your sharing your method though so don’t take it the wrong way.

[FiveOh_Racing]

@About500Rabbits

@xCaesars Wrathx

Hey folks how’s it going, I have for you two very simple very easy techniques for to set your car’s with a good strong balanced setup regarding your ARB’s and suspension.

WHAT YOU WILL NEED

The cars weight, the cars distribution (front %) and a scientific calculator or your phone (just for the % button).

You can find the front when you press up on the D pad from the cars build section where all the cars stats are shown.

ANTI ROLL BARS

This is the simplest technique of the two, The maximum number you can have on your ARB’s in the Forza is 40.0 front and rear.

So example if your car has a 50% front spilt (50% of the cars overall wieght) then you will type in to your calculator 40 - 50% which will = 20 as your ARB front value, this will obviously leave 50% left on the rear which will also result as 20 your rear ARB Value.

Now if you have a split of 43% front your Rear will of course be 57%, so you use exactly the same method. The % Front shown in game will almost always work out your front ARB then you would use the remaining % to work out the rear, so like I said if the front is 43% the remainder is 57% (always work it as 100% overall).
In some case you can try invert your results to change the cars behaviour. This can work well on AWD types

SUSPENSION SETUP

With suspension we use basically the same method but with an added difference. So for this we need to include the cars weight aswell.

So if the car weights 3,000 lbs and has a front of 50% it will have an even split front and rear there for you’ll have 1,500 lbs Front and Rear, since the 1,500 has to be split between both wheels at the front and rear you then simply devide the 1,500 by 2 which will give you 750 lbs (in game front suspension represents 1 wheel as does the rear).

This is how it should look on your calculator working a 50% 3,000 - 50% = 1,500 ÷ 2 = 750

When working with any front % value the game gives you, it will always equal your cars Rear value. Ie if you take away 43% of the cars overall wieght it will equal to the 57% left over (Rear value now divide by 2), likewise if you take away 57% of the cars overall wieght it will equal the 43% left over (Front value now divide by 2).

Again as with the ARB’s you can invert these result (swap them around) to change the cars behaviour.

Hope this helps you out, and please feel free to leave feed back, happy tuning Folks.

Questions???
You can get hold of me at any of the following.
XBL xCaesars Wrathx
My Twitter
My twitch channel

I’m sorry but I’m completely lost here. Why are you using the weight per corner as the basis for your total suspension stiffness?? I know it’s a simple method but in my experience it’s over sprung the lighter cars.

I Don’t understand the method behind the roll bars either because the softest you can set them to is 1 giving you a range of 39 not 40. I know you’re giving it as an example and you’re just giving the example to show the way you “balance” the car but I’m just a touch confused by the results because the resulting ARB stiffness doesn’t vary by spring stiffness or damping which has an effect on roll too. It looks like it’s giving the results based on idealistic balance instead of actual balance.

It’s good that your sharing your method though so don’t take it the wrong way.

Okay so, only being devils advocate here, ONLY…
Example:
Car curb weight 3000 @ 53% Front bias and 47% Rear
Theory only here if what I have seen others post and their line of thinking (not mine per se, just many)
Sprung and unsprung weight (opinion Forza doesn’t care wither way, but I am not an expert)
Unsprung = brakes, wheels, tires, etc. roughly 10% total weight
or would that be 10% for each corner for a total of 40% unsprung weight…

So math 3000 x .40 (unsprung weight) = 1200 - 3000 = 1800 (sprung weight)
Now, 1800 x .53 = 954 / 2 = 477 Front Springs
And, 1800 x .47 = 846 / 2 = 423 Rear Springs
And ARB’s
39 x .53 = 20.67 Front ARB
39 x .47 = 18.33 Rear ARB

Just curious on your line of thinking there without engineering formulas and having to break out a scientific calc, u know.

[About500Rabbits]

Okay so, only being devils advocate here, ONLY…
Example:
Car curb weight 3000 @ 53% Front bias and 47% Rear
Theory only here if what I have seen others post and their line of thinking (not mine per se, just many)
Sprung and unsprung weight (opinion Forza doesn’t care wither way, but I am not an expert)
Unsprung = brakes, wheels, tires, etc. roughly 10% total weight
or would that be 10% for each corner for a total of 40% unsprung weight…

So math 3000 x .40 (unsprung weight) = 1200 - 3000 = 1800 (sprung weight)
Now, 1800 x .53 = 954 / 2 = 477 Front Springs
And, 1800 x .47 = 846 / 2 = 423 Rear Springs
And ARB’s
39 x .53 = 20.67 Front ARB
39 x .47 = 18.33 Rear ARB

Just curious on your line of thinking there without engineering formulas and having to break out a scientific calc, u know.

It’s be about 10% of the total weight not 40%. If you want to take the unsprung weight off then do so but it doesn’t appear as if it’s really necessary, I know my original formula worked on removing the unsprung weight from the equation but leaving it in makes little difference.

[aka_John_Caesar]

Hey 500rabbits and TVRACING, thanks for your comments. Firstly regarding the suspension some people do take in to account sprung and unsprung as like in real world. But in Forza this is something I have never done personally, I always use the cars total wieght, Forza is not 100% sim more like 80% sim some real world methods I believe through trail and error are not applicable in Forza. The ARB’S Rabit your spot on with, there is a range of 39 and not 40 but the difference of 1 is hardly worth mentioning and it adds a touch of stability.

It is ofcause designed to give an ideal (base) balance from which you make your minor adjustments from. Please see my full guide also.

[About500Rabbits]

@xCaesars Wrathx

Hey 500rabbits and TVRACING, thanks for your comments. Firstly regarding the suspension some people do take in to account sprung and unsprung as like in real world. But in Forza this is something I have never done personally, I always use the cars total wieght, Forza is not 100% sim more like 80% sim some real world methods I believe through trail and error are not applicable in Forza. The ARB’S Rabit your spot on with, there is a range of 39 and not 40 but the difference of 1 is hardly worth mentioning and it adds a touch of stability.

It is ofcause designed to give an ideal (base) balance from which you make your minor adjustments from. Please see my full guide also.

Ok I can’t really argue with it. It’s interesting to see how other tuner create the balance for their cars, whether of not its a method I would use I don’t know. To me the numbers just look off, looks like an understeery base which if I’m being perfectly honest is better than an oversteery base.

I’ve looked at your guide and it’s pretty good, great for the newcomers and a few of those who call themselves veterans could learn from it too. So props to you, can go into detail with what kind of damping you run with that??? I’d guess low bump and high rebound???

Rabbits

[aka_John_Caesar]

@About500Rabbits

@xCaesars Wrathx

Hey 500rabbits and TVRACING, thanks for your comments. Firstly regarding the suspension some people do take in to account sprung and unsprung as like in real world. But in Forza this is something I have never done personally, I always use the cars total wieght, Forza is not 100% sim more like 80% sim some real world methods I believe through trail and error are not applicable in Forza. The ARB’S Rabit your spot on with, there is a range of 39 and not 40 but the difference of 1 is hardly worth mentioning and it adds a touch of stability.

It is ofcause designed to give an ideal (base) balance from which you make your minor adjustments from. Please see my full guide also.

Ok I can’t really argue with it. It’s interesting to see how other tuner create the balance for their cars, whether of not its a method I would use I don’t know. To me the numbers just look off, looks like an understeery base which if I’m being perfectly honest is better than an oversteery base.

I’ve looked at your guide and it’s pretty good, great for the newcomers and a few of those who call themselves veterans could learn from it too. So props to you, can go into detail with what kind of damping you run with that??? I’d guess low bump and high rebound???

Rabbits

Yea like you say it’s mainly for the newcomers and maybe some veterans also aha and yes and yes generally I do.
Thanks again for your comment

[About500Rabbits]

@xCaesars Wrathx

@About500Rabbits

@xCaesars Wrathx

Hey 500rabbits and TVRACING, thanks for your comments. Firstly regarding the suspension some people do take in to account sprung and unsprung as like in real world. But in Forza this is something I have never done personally, I always use the cars total wieght, Forza is not 100% sim more like 80% sim some real world methods I believe through trail and error are not applicable in Forza. The ARB’S Rabit your spot on with, there is a range of 39 and not 40 but the difference of 1 is hardly worth mentioning and it adds a touch of stability.

It is ofcause designed to give an ideal (base) balance from which you make your minor adjustments from. Please see my full guide also.

Ok I can’t really argue with it. It’s interesting to see how other tuner create the balance for their cars, whether of not its a method I would use I don’t know. To me the numbers just look off, looks like an understeery base which if I’m being perfectly honest is better than an oversteery base.

I’ve looked at your guide and it’s pretty good, great for the newcomers and a few of those who call themselves veterans could learn from it too. So props to you, can go into detail with what kind of damping you run with that??? I’d guess low bump and high rebound???

Rabbits

Yea like you say it’s mainly for the newcomers and maybe some veterans also aha and yes and yes generally I do.
Thanks again for your comment

Have you tried running softer springs with a long bumps top and lower rebound?? It works really well, feels much more progressive and much smoother.

[aka_John_Caesar]

@About500Rabbits

@xCaesars Wrathx

@About500Rabbits

@xCaesars Wrathx

Hey 500rabbits and TVRACING, thanks for your comments. Firstly regarding the suspension some people do take in to account sprung and unsprung as like in real world. But in Forza this is something I have never done personally, I always use the cars total wieght, Forza is not 100% sim more like 80% sim some real world methods I believe through trail and error are not applicable in Forza. The ARB’S Rabit your spot on with, there is a range of 39 and not 40 but the difference of 1 is hardly worth mentioning and it adds a touch of stability.

It is ofcause designed to give an ideal (base) balance from which you make your minor adjustments from. Please see my full guide also.

Ok I can’t really argue with it. It’s interesting to see how other tuner create the balance for their cars, whether of not its a method I would use I don’t know. To me the numbers just look off, looks like an understeery base which if I’m being perfectly honest is better than an oversteery base.

I’ve looked at your guide and it’s pretty good, great for the newcomers and a few of those who call themselves veterans could learn from it too. So props to you, can go into detail with what kind of damping you run with that??? I’d guess low bump and high rebound???

Rabbits

Yea like you say it’s mainly for the newcomers and maybe some veterans also aha and yes and yes generally I do.
Thanks again for your comment

Have you tried running softer springs with a long bumps top and lower rebound?? It works really well, feels much more progressive and much smoother.

I mainly tune by feel once I have my base, but on FM5 alot if my tune would have stiff rebound, soft bumps and medium to soft springs, idk know if I’ve given it enough testing but I don’t feel it works aswell on FM6.

[About500Rabbits]

Try running soft spring with a stiffer bump and softer rebound, you get more roll but the over all result seems to be smoother and more reliable than the old ways of FM4 and 5. Try out some of my ferraris or either of the lotus in my thread see what you think.

Just an idea though

[aka_John_Caesar]

@About500Rabbits

Try running soft spring with a stiffer bump and softer rebound, you get more roll but the over all result seems to be smoother and more reliable than the old ways of FM4 and 5. Try out some of my ferraris or either of the lotus in my thread see what you think.

Just an idea though

How that Evora run I’m quiet intrigued by that lil thing

[About500Rabbits]

@xCaesars Wrathx

@About500Rabbits

Try running soft spring with a stiffer bump and softer rebound, you get more roll but the over all result seems to be smoother and more reliable than the old ways of FM4 and 5. Try out some of my ferraris or either of the lotus in my thread see what you think.

Just an idea though

How that Evora run I’m quiet intrigued by that lil thing

I’ll share my tune with you so you can see the set up tomorrow.