I’m a part of this gaming community on facebook and someone asked a question about Forza that, quite frankly I didn’t have an answer for, so I’d like to post that question here. The question is as follows;
"So here is the question. Why do we frown upon using TCS, STM and ABS in Forza? In real world driving conditions most of these auto makers have these tuned to aid the driver in getting faster lap times yet we frown on it in the game? Could it be simply that these systems are not represented accurately from each manufacturer in Forza itself, as they aren’t? You would never deactivate these systems in a Ferrari or Lamborghini if you were trying to set a lap time on a real world circuit. Even professional drivers will leave these alone a great deal of the time unless the systems are particularly invasive (Mercedes-AMG). Same goes for the automatic versus manual argument. I do understand this a bit more but given the state of the real world automatic transmissions these days and how few manual transmission make it into high performance cars it seems Forza, in my opinion, needs to restructure its point system to account for this. It is not realistic and true to life anymore."
Quite honestly, I don’t know enough about any of this to answer it myself which is why I’d like to hear from those who might be more knowledgeable. Ta.
There are a select few who run ‘hardcore’ that are elitist no assist heroes. They’ll think that even though they’re slower than a leaderboard guy on pace, they’re more skilled because they run ‘hardcore’ with no line or anything. Most others won’t really judge or care. Unless it’s autobrake. Keep that off!
Many assists are actually a hindrance. STM is a killer and I’d avoid that like the plague. TCS is very intrusive on this game so if you can avoid it, or if you set up your car such that it doesn’t get bogged down by it, then you’ll get some decent gains. ABS is a preferential one. I found more pace without it and was able to brake harder with more grip. Many still use it though.
Manual with clutch is almost a prerequisite. The clutch is useful in pretty much anything bar the racing cars. the amount of time you can gain on every shift is insane.
Quick question–what’s the issue with STM? I find that when I turn STM off, the back of my car yaws badly as I go around turns. It’s entirely possible this is down to my poor driving skills, though.
It could be a lot of things. STM will engage if it thinks you’re going to crash. What causes it to think that could be anything. It could be driving, or if something unsettles the car and perhaps if the car’s setup poorly build or tune wise. Or it could be any combo of the aforementioned.
Often you may push the car naturally beyond what the game thinks is limit which will trigger STM. I actually drive quite lightly with more ‘finesse’ so you don’t scrub the tyres and the car’s less likely to unsettle.
Who is we ? The game is for you man, play it whatever the way makes you happy.
The reason you get rewarded for turning these off is so that you challenge yourself, try to raise the game difficulty. And not all real cars will be faster in all conditions with aids on, as switching them off in the game not always yields faster times.
What I do know is that in the world of Forza STM and TCS will make your lap times slower. One exception is with the high powered race cars. I find I can get quicker times with TCS on but otherwise I leave it off. Many people use ABS to help them not lock up the brakes but I keep it off because I can brake harder and for a shorter distance thus making quicker lap times.
IMO the only people that ‘frown’ upon others using assists are just being elitists. The assists are there for people to use if they so wish and there is no shame in that.
The thing to remember here is that this is a video game. A car IRL may be faster with the assists on but that doesn’t translate over to the game probably due to the fact that these systems can be very complex and difficult to recreate given the limitations of a video game when compared to the real world. I also believe that the game is designed in such a way to reward players who use no assists with quicker lap times. I just don’t think it’s possible for a game to recreate how every car drives IRL 100%.
I’ve never used STM on any of the games until this one. I mostly use RWD cars and found that on this game my rear tires are much more likely to slide out as opposed to the previous games, particularly FM5. I’ve tried adjusting for this, with little success, with my tunes by increasing rear stability and creating a good balance of over/understeer. As far as lap times, I find that I’m running top 100 times on most circuits with STM on and have considerably slower times with it off. The manual shifting ON, and ABS OFF feature seem to be a must as far as better acceleration and shorter breaking distances.
Real life and Forza are very different when it comes to driving aids. Forza seems to be the same across the board for every car.
TCS/STM - in real life I do turn it off when I am tracking as I like to have a bit more room for pushing the car past its limit. Technically if you are activating either one of these in real life you are driving beyond the limits of the vehicle and getting worse lap times because the aids have to slow you down. If you are smooth on the track you shouldn’t be activating either IMO. Traction control is useful if you have a lot of power and can’t feather it out of the turn. In Forza I like them off because it helps me rotate the car especially in tight hairpin corners, I give a little more gas and spin the car around.
ABS - in real life I would never get rid of it if the car comes with it. But the case is the same as other aids, if you are activating ABS coming into a turn you over driving the limits of the car and should try to be more smooth. In Forza I think having ABS helps me break harder and adds more challenge to the game.
Automatic vs. manual shifting - the reason I don’t use automatic in Forza is that it doesnt hold RPMs where I want them, I do not want the car to shift when I am mid corner.
I am not a big online racer but when I do race, it doesn’t bother me one bit if someone else has all the aids turned on. It just means I have to be that more careful in order to keep up.
Wondering what cars you are having trouble with? I have found that I have to be much more careful with inputs in Forza 6.
Guys, I understand iit in the context of the game. The question is concerned with why is it that way in the game if it isn’t strictly reflected in real life?
The game just does what it has been programmed to do. Whilst in real life you can play around and adjust it all, on Forza it’s just static. It’s just a game thing. From that, people learn what shaves tenths off and what kills your momentum.
Because it’s a game, not a simulator. It’s not meant to strictly reflect real life.
Also, imagine the effort of trying to simulate the hundreds of cars in the game. Everyone will have different e.g. TCS, some will have it fixed, some will have on / off button, some will have several settings, some will have a knob, etc. It’s just not possible to have every single one test driven in all possible configurations.
I’m not going to get into opinions, beliefs, feelings, or philosophies; just the facts.
The fact is, at the bottom line, once you cut through the excuses and rationale, that these are driver aids intended to help the driver. If you’re using driver aids, you’re relying on help to drive. It doesn’t matter if it’s technically on the real car or if it makes you faster, as the remaining fact is that by using these you got help driving. There’s no getting around the fact that you went for help controlling your car.
What I’ve told people is that if you feel you want or need help, take the help. That’s what aids are for. Everyone should be able to enjoy the game (as long as that doesn’t involve ruining other players’ experiences by trolling multiplayer races by crashing or by painting up cars with offensive imagery). I just insist on not making excuses for it. If you use driver aids, you relied on help and that’s the bottom line; no excuses or justifications.
Some players prefer not relying on help and are proud of their ability to drive without help, even if that sets them up for potential disaster via one miscalculation of brake pressure or throttle input. They may feel it a bit unfair to race with someone using aids because aids help prevent locking up brakes and missing the turn or spinning out by accidentally giving it too much gas. They’re playing on hard mode against someone playing on easy mode.
While i agree with most of what you are saying, there is à point when the aids will no longer help you. It has been my experience that aids will slow you down very notably, like 4 sec à lap. My hat is off to those that run with no assists, but i chalenge you to race some of my rival s times with all assists on before you make blanket statments about easy mode.
Do you know how much work, computational power, and lines of code it takes for the traction control, stability management, and ABS system for a single vehicle? Let’s pick the Mercedes AMG GT S. Now keep in mind that the Mercedes C63 has a different set up. Now keep in mind that Mercedes makes more than these two cars. That’s a lot of work, computational power, and code.
Mercedes isn’t going to make this code available to Turn 10 to model in their game. Even in the event that Mercedes did allow Turn 10 access to this code do you think the game and the Xbox One could handle that in the game? Probably not. And then you want to do that for all the cars in the game? Good luck.
In Forza Motorsport it is not realistic to replicate the TCS, STM, and ABS systems across the cars. Turn 10 has made these systems as more of a difficulty adjustment and they tend to be the same across the vehicles. Is the game too easy? Do you want a challenge? Turn off TCS. Can’t handle the car? The wheels spin too much? Turn on TCS but don’t use ABS. It’s all an option that you can take based on how you want to play the game.
In the real world, it took a while for these “assists” to become helpful. There was a day when the TCS or ABS system in a car wasn’t that good, it wasn’t in tune with what the driver wanted, and using it would very clearly result in a slower lap time. Unfortunately, those systems of the past are the ones that are comparable to what Forza Motorsport uses in their games. You are right, it’s not true to life anymore. When Forza first came out, it was true to life but times have changed and sadly, the Xbox cannot handle that change.
I run Hardcore assists out of personal preference (I get a better “feel” from the car) but generally don’t have an issue with people running assists that affect how their car handles. As some have mentioned you practically “need” TCS in high-powered cars in order to be competitive for example.
The Driving Line however is a different matter; once you know a track layout you shouldn’t need to rely on a co-driver for braking markers
