There are a lot of things wrong with the Renault RS17 Formula One car. The suspension travel makes it seem like you’re constantly racing off road, there is no actual hybrid system, the brakes are stupidly good and the handling is completely off. The weirdest problem however is that the DRS is ALWAYS open over 60 km/h and (thankfully) it doesn’t affect the handling. Why, since we can’t even use DRS ourselves, isn’t the rear wing closed? Please, fix this issue.
A lot of the suspension setup can be fixed it tuning very easily. Just increase the suspension stiffness, rebound stiffness and bump stiffness. The engine produces far more power than it should, to fix this go into “Race Settings” then make the “Power Handicap” = 0.85. The drs isn’t really an issue tbh though I do think it should be kept closed constantly or at least increase the kmh to where it opens to something like 200kmh. Remember the McLaren P1 does this too.
If you go into the Tuners Lounge I have a realistic F1 Tune for the 2018 Toro Rosso Honda or if you want some advice on how to make the car more realistic PM me.
My tunes are constantly updated and will be tonight btw.
Also I do agree that Forza needs to fix the R.S.17. I could name about 10 problems with it. Including the driver’s gloves clipping through the cockpit.
Someone watched JSR Devon’s latest video
7 Likes
They are good videos.
Beat me to it
While this may be a bot OT it does concern this car. In my effort to complete all the Career races I now find myself at the F1 series that uses this car. Admittedly I do not like X-Class cars at all. Things just happen too fast for this 66 year old, but I have up until now been soldiering through them. I ran the first race in this series, at Road America, Long Race length, Expert AI, While I did win I have to admit I did make some “Aggressive” passes at times. But now I just can’t seem to make myself press the Start Button on the next race, which is at Virginia. Whoever thought that an F1 car needed to run on this track. 2 nights now and I can’t make myself do it. Should I just go ahead and shorten the race length and drop the AI difficulty? I just have this series, the Hypercar Series and then the 2 Open Championships to go to complete the Career.
Big problem with the R.S.17 is that Forza believes it has around 1110 HP. That simply isn’t accurate, especially in race trim. Mercedes who have the best engine say they’re nearing 1000 HP so there is no way in hell the renault has that much. 950 ish would be more accurate.
May or may not. Though they absolutely have. Example : Have you noticed the 2017 Porsche 911 RSR has actually changed physically two or three times since it has been released?
The cars are toned down considerably in race trim, and Forza’s RS17 is considerably even beyond qualifying trim. I saw JSR Devon’s video and I do feel it’s just a weird car. FM6’s Lotus was also much the same though without the weird decision of physically bouncy suspension.
But you have to think in a way in terms of engine performance - the car is almost as if it wasn’t regulated by the FIA at all. The car in game if I remember correctly revs well beyond 11,500 nor is it restricted to fuel flow or the needing to last multiple races to avoid penalties. So the guessing of 950ish, while true if realistic, is a turned down to be reliable 950ish combined PU/ICE. It could probably be rated at 1100 if it wasn’t restricted without the risk of detonating.
At least that’s my 2 cents.
Fixing the suspension is relatively easy, you just have to max out the front suspension stiffness, front rebound stiffness and front bump stiffness. The front roll bars you can keep kinda soft but again stiff roll bars is a safe bet to stop that bounciness. The rear suspension can be soft and so can the rear bump stiffness and rear rebound stiffness but you HAVE to run max rear anti-roll bars otherwise the car’s front end lifts when turning and makes the physics go crazy. That pretty much fixes that problem. The suspension maxed out is still too soft but there’s nothing more you can do. The car is way past qualifying trim in terms of power. Way WAY past. 1110hp is even beyond Mercedes right now in the 2018 season in qualifying trim let alone 2017. Like I said, they’re just about nearing 1000hp and I’m certain that’s qualifying trim because in the race they more than likely use a lot less to save the engine for reliability. Sure the Renault could probably push out 1110hp if they wanted to but the engine would not last long and the fuel would deplete way too quick. Not to mention the car would be a dog to drive with 1110hp, which it is in the game if you use no assists like real life. IRL the car does rev past 11,500 I think technically it can rev to 13,000 rpm irl but they shift at 11,000 ish which Forza does get right because in Forza that’s where the power band is so I have to say Forza get that right. The car is simply too fast for the physics I think and that’s down primarily to the engine.
Here’s the full list of problems with the car:
DRS is pretty much always open. (Doesn’t affect the handling but it looks dumb.)
The soft tire compound wears out way too much.
The fuel depletes way too fats.
The suspension travel is too much.
The front tire lifts while turning due to the weird suspension.
The car produces too much HP.
The driver’s gloves clip through the cockpit.
The cockpit camera (POV) is way too high.
The tire PSI is way too high. Even though you can tune this to be lower, for some reason it makes you lose grip. An F1 car does not handle best at 28 or 28.5 PSI like in Forza.
Some of this is relatively fixable such as the power. Just set the power handicap to around 0.8 or 0.85 and that makes the power way more realistic for race trim. This also improves the tire wear and fuel economy but it doesn’t make it realistic enough sadly. The suspension is also relatively fixable but tbh, it’s still too bouncy and just doesn’t suit F1. The front tire lifting you can kind of fix but not fully no matter how much you try, though you can improve it. Sadly pretty much everything else in un-fixable. Turn 10 really need to update and patch this car. They can do it, they did a performance patch for the Ford Daytona Prototype back in Forza 6 so it can be done but it’s more of a question of whether they can be bothered and I don’t think they care.
the renault will not get a change, or update.
turn 10 doesn’t change cars, because people start talking details that 90% of people wouldn’t know.
also, they will not reset a whole division’s leaderboard times to lower hp, or whatever…
but you can tune cars, and handicap power, so get out there and fix what isn’t correct in the real world,
car game based on cars, not a sim…
2 Likes
Are you trolling us? You do realize that Forza 7 competitor has no problem fixing car balance when they see a problem don’t you?
Below is one of their more recent updates. Have a look and see for yourself.
https://www.gran-turismo.com/gb/gtsport/news/00_3053440.html
Forza 7’s competitor, however, doesn’t have track leaderboards based on cars and, more importantly, doesn’t have a function that allows players to share tunes and be rewarded with in-game credits for downloads. Forza’s community and UGC functions dictate the need for the game to always remain pretty much the same, even amongst different iterations of the game, but especially more so during a title’s lifetime.
If they seriously adjusted the physics of the game (something that could be achieved quite easily), many of the “top 10 tunes” out there would likely become useless, and they’d have to wipe the leaderboards. And believe me, the community wouldn’t let T10 hear the end of it.
1 Like
Sigh…
https://psnprofiles.com/game-leaderboard/6806-gran-turismo-sport
Looks like their leaderboard wasn’t an excuse for them not to fix their own cars…
Some people would complain yes but I think the majority of the community would prefer a wiped leaderboard with a working car than not.
1 Like
That made too much sense to me. Wiping the leader boards would be the best option here if the car’s characteristics are not what was expected.
They have this whole shiny FIA license thing so they’re kinda forced to do it.
I remember Project CARS did it at some point but the changes were much more timid and basically restricted to GT3 which is what everyone races competitively in that game.
Ah, yes. I should have structured my post a bit better. But I see you got the gist of it.
I do find it odd, too, that 2 of the car classes seem to behave differently from the rest (as you mentioned earlier). I hope that it would be addressed and brought back in line. But who knows at this point. I’m still looking to get brake lights to actually be visible from 30’ away, lol.
So many different aspects of the game that needs to be fix…I digress.
And we all respected that decision in the end. I think we can agree with that. It was something that showed us that we are getting a better racing experience in the end.
I didn’t buy F7 on it’s own merit. I got F7 because of my experience with F4. But so far here is some of the things that confuse me:
-Gas doesn’t play any real factor. You always have enough. Am I always lean, sometimes rich…I don’t know.
-Some racing cars don’t allow you to use racing brakes (huh? why is that an option?)
-No Pitting Options and how to decrease your pit time. If all I want is tires how do I do this?
-Different type of racing tire types. IE: If it rains do I want to go full wets or intermediates? Or, do I want to try a 15 lap race on hards and try for just 1 pit? Perhaps mediums are more a safe bet? I like choices. And I like to learn what works best for that track and track conditions when racing. That is by no means being “hard core racer”. Just basic stuff. If it is let the AI decide for you so you an just race.
Also, it’s apparent, to me at least, that the F1 and GP RS17 use soft compound racing tires. They go yellow only after 2-3 laps. I cannot say what racing compound is used for other vehicles I can say that no other car I’ve driven in F7 does that.
Look, I am not a serious “pro racer” just a guy who casually plays. I love Forza 7. I really do. But this game has more often then not left me very confused and bewildered as to how to RACE. I at times, really do get the impression that this is Horizon on racing tracks.
I’m not the only one either. Take a look at this comparison between RS17 on: Forza 7 vs F1 2017
He did 1 lap and has all yellow tires.
Here is another video back when F7 was released. No tire wear issue. But the difference in physics are clear
And another for comparison:
One last thing. Can someone explain to me why Forza 7 cars seem to “Pivot” around corners when viewed from the rear. Example Here:
As you can see between F7 and F1 2017 the F7 car’s front end seems to pivot towards the apex. I don’t get it.
This is because the bulk of the community does not race long events… “Endurance” racing in Forza is 10 laps… So Turn 10 will go with what caters to most people, which is why they don’t bother with pit stops, qualifying and tire compounds. Believe it or not, but as soon as you add rain most people already treat it as “hardcore”. Most people hate to race in the wet even without dynamic weather.
Out of those three I find qualifying to be the least important as it’s very easy to implement but also very difficult to get right. I wish there were “proper” pit stops with fuel-corrected performance but for most people this is too complex. The F1 cars seem to be there “just because”. IMO, NASCAR is the one division that suffers the most from lack of pit stops.
Remember that you get yellow with only 25% wear… There is a drop in grip but hardly enough to make you coast. In F1 with the soft tires all you get are 5 laps of all out pace at most anyway.
When it comes to unrealistic braking I feel the biggest problem is the impact aero has on braking. It’s too much. That’s why you drive an F1 with the most downforce in the game and it brakes in an instant. It’s also annoying in the lower classes because wings lower PI while drastically improving the car due to improved handling as well as braking performance. C-class will already demand wing to be competitive and the bolted on stuff manages to be superior to active aero in expensive supercars. And some cars which do not have stock aero, such as Shelby GT350R, get more downforce from wing upgrade than others, which leads to them dominating their division.
Educational, thanks!
So this IS Horizon with just race tracks after all. What you said explains so much to me. You’ve also help clear up some of the confusion I have with Forza 7 down force. I have to be honest I’ve tried cornering down force and I simply didn’t gain anything from it other then lower accel/top end. For me it’s borked unless you know the exact numbers to use to balance front with rear. This is one area were a more simplified toggle would work instead of numerical values. Speed, Acceleration, Balance, Cornering for starters. That’s one area that you don’t “guess at”. Same for other aspects of upgrading. But that’s my tidbit of an opinion there. Again, I’m a casual player.
But with C Class you’ve helped me understand how important it is more so then other classes. For me I was trying to get it to work for me in A and S Classes but it looks like C Class is the sweet spot.
I was under the impression that the active down force on some cars was cosmetic. It’s amazing how the development of this game programs your thinking in a certain way. You are absolutely right. It should be “working” but it certainly doesn’t.
Or better still keep the numerical values used for tuning and simply incorporate the development team Tuning App into the game via update. The fact that it’s not there knowing we have numeric values for turning also confuses me to no end. And I have to assume that the development team has such an App through making an educated guess. Why not share it to the customers? It’s impossible to guess, nor was it ever designed to “guess at” number for tuning these cars. It’s wonderful that the community at large provides such apps and even provide cars already tuned for you although locked (unlike F4). But its puzzling why this isn’t incorporated in the game as of 3 versions later from F4.
Perhaps that’s all that might be needed for RS17, FM7’s development tool that would help us properly tune the car. Sure, I could fine a good tuner out there but that’s a lot of research for someone who picks up this game casually.
In any case, thank you for your input. Some things are clearer now.
This is not what I have said at all…
If you play any Horizon game you’ll clearly spot the difference between Forza Horizon and Forza Motorsport.