To say there are some issues with race craft and race etiquette, in online multiplayer races, would be an understatement. I believe everyone could use a refresher from time to time. Back when I was racing every weekend, we had a mandatory drivers meeting the day before or the morning of the race. We also had post race drivers meetings, where penalties and reprimands were handed out, and, more often than not, drivers thanked each other for avoiding contact and keeping it clean. This was mostly because the drivers were the owners and we had small sponsors that would never cover the cost of replacing our engine or transmission, let alone a car. If we got enough to cover tires, fuel and fees, we were happy.
I was looking through some articles about race craft and etiquette, and came across this one.
It recognizes the grey areas, and how drivers approach them, most of the time. Of course, even in real life people make mistakes or get over ambitious, and wrecks happen. But this article helps to understand why we don’t see, in real life, what we see in online multiplayer racing. Or we don’t see it very often.
It’s a good read, in my opinion.
A little helpful instruction never hurt anyone. I think I recall a book that came with the version of FM2 I had that also offered some basic instruction.
Unfortunately, to get to this stage we’ve first got to get a high percentage of players to realise that the object of the game is to get from light to flag without demolishing everything in sight and another high percentage to realise that being overtaken isn’t the end of the damn world
You are absolutely correct. That has become my mission. To SOMEHOW raise awareness that Clean Laps Matter! To offer any assistance I can when I see folks struggling, and HOPEFULLY influence a few folks towards cleaner racing.
Edit: I have the PRIMA Guides for Forza, Forza 2 and Forza 3. They have a lot of great information about racing lines, cornering and apexes, types of turns and braking techniques.
They also cover upgrades and tuning tips at a beginner level.
Peace
Haha…I have the Prima guide to FM3 since that is where I first started online racing.
Nothing better or more enjoyable than setting up perfectly clean pass on someone that races properly. The sore ones I just let go and pass later on the straights when they refuse to pit their damaged cars or most likely when they are busy trying to bully through the next driver. I have unfortunately made more passes like this due to the more over aggressive drivers in this game. Only part I miss about FM4 multiplayer were the cleaner drivers…sigh
Hopefully it will change somewhat in FM6…at least in leagues. I will always do my part to race clean and show the faster guys that they can get by me without cutting or wrecking. I will move off the line if you are lapping me or just significantly quicker than me on the current track. Helps to know your strong points and weak ones too. Yas, I can’t do fast…but give me Watkins, Prague, Rio. Those I know well.
I’ll say it again for the last time: what you people fail to realize is that this is A GAME !!! A GAME played by people across all AGE GROUPS of various temperaments and mental sanity levels. While leagues deal with skill segregation, it cannot deal with sanity levels and temperaments in a GAME. If you’re in the Professional League, that’s just one step away from Enthusiast and you will find a reasonable amount of crashers and psycho’s there is my guess. In Elite players, I would expect more of this "etiquette " being demonstrable there. is my guess. And in Pinnacle, everyone should be saints wearing halos due to the immense skillsets which takes a certain maturity to acquire anyway. But really this is still a game where kids as young as 9 yrs old play and grown ups as old as octogenarians play, all with various temperaments that foster tolerance or vindictiveness while jostling for position within races. Now that simulation damage is on in the leagues, it’s really just a matter or luck to join a lobby where all racers are on their best behavior depending on the division you’re in. For the most part you need to develop a certain tolerance for evasion and stealth and grow a set of bionic eyes that allow you to see through the dense fog of crashes ahead !!! Good luck with that !!!
Well darn it, I already ordered my Captain Clean lap cape and secret ring, and now you question my sanity…ok, it’s been questioned before…
I realize the demographics (age and sanity included), but I know it’s entirely possible to realize significant improvements, in online multiplayer racing, by raising awareness and actually helping people rather than alienating them.
Of course there will always be griefers and, dare I say the insane element. But a lot of what I am seeing is a lack of race craft due to inexperience ( I include myself in those categories, so I am not being condescending). Even a slower guy like me can help someone better understand clean racing, and steer them towards information on how to learn better race craft.
I promise to never wear the cape in online races, but the secret ring is staying on (I’ve wanted one since losing my secret decoder ring back in 1964).
Very good read for all skill levels of play. Hope it find it’s mark. Even if it let just one person think a bit, it’s still way better than just accepting this is just a game and nothing can be done. Best wishes for your efforts to help changing things.
It seems that I have ended up in lobbies with 6 or 7 of the same guys the last few nights. It’s nice to know who is way faster and who you can race with. There is nothing more fun than racing side by side and back and forth with someone you know won’t intentionally take you out. I don’t care if it for first or 12th it’s always fun. Accidents happen but when both understand that it’s a blast.
While it is very noble of you to post an article such as that and I agree with most of your comments on clean racing and other like topics on this board, you have to bear in mind that only a tiny minority of players ever go to these pages. To change things for the better T10 need to change core game mechanics such as altering track limits and introducing real in game penalties for crashing into other cars or driving off track. When the game itself allows and sometimes rewards these behaviors, no amount of forum shame is going to negate them.
The only reward for good behavior is improved start position based on fastest clean lap. This can backfire though when the crashes rear end you on the first turn instead or like in a game tonight, they rear end me by not braking on the last corner of a lap, thereby making what could have been my best lap a dirty one. I’ll admit, I’m not very good at this game, but I won’t crash people because they are better or to make up a position or two.
I am not so naive as to think anything I do will make any kind of a significant impact. But, if I help one person to better understand race craft and race etiquette, and they pay it forward, well…that’s more than is being done now, besides a whole lot of complaining. If by some odd chance a few others decide to become proactive in the effort, that’s even better.
Sure, there are things Turn 10 could do to improve the online multiplayer experience. I don’t know that it’s as easy as a lot of folks think it is, but I believe improvements can be made. I cannot control what Turn 10 do. I can join the hordes of those already complaining or even those who believe Turn 10 is deliberately “taking things away and ruining the game on purpose” (seriously, they are among us). Or, I can just do my level best to enjoy the game, while also trying to steer people towards better race craft and race etiquette (something a lot of players know absolutely nothing about, and many could care less).
So, if you want to choose the path of complaining until you are blue in the face, getting angry and hating Turn 10, by all means have at it. But, don’t rain on my parade if I choose a more positive approach. I can assure you nothing I do will require ANY effort on your part, and will not rob you of ANY opportunities to complain. I respect your opinion, all I ask is the same respect. My intentions are good.
Have a great day and good racing.
Good read, but I don’t think it applies to Forza. Nothing is ever stopping deliberate wrecking, which is the main cause of problems in the game. But what is creating the most problems after that for overtaking IMO is not racing itself or race etiquette but simply the unability to recognize a car is passing you. If you don’t have a 3D sound system you are basically screwed. If you drive in third person you may have a slight understanding of what to do. In cockpit view or hood view you are lost. Even if you see someone disappearing from the rear view mirror you have no idea where exactly he. And while watching for your brake point it is hard to flick the right stick to look. Or even impossible, if you’re not using automatic transmission, because you only have so many thumbs. You can either just give away a corner if you know that someone is beside you (even though you know you might be faster) to avoid a collision or you can drive like there is nobody besides you.
The main problem here is FOV, not driver skills. In real life racing you can rely on your peripheral vision and audio cues to know where the others are around you, if you’re racing in a first person perspective with stereo sound and automatic transmission (like most players do) it is impossible to avoid crashes in every situation unless you want to end up in last place.
Are you serious with this? You don’t need a top end sound system to realize people are overtaking you. The game gives distance to the nearest cars and if those values are decreasing than someone is gaining. It seems to me people just aren’t paying attention or perhaps don’t care and want to keep their position at all cost even if someone could make a clean pass. Most players don’t know blocking isn’t cool. On the flip side they should also be aware that cars ahead will brake before turns and plan thier braking accordingly.
*edit. Btw I drive in cockpit view only and don’t have any issues.
I respect your opinion, but disagree. The main problem is definitely not intentional wreckers. They are a problem, but not the biggest problem. I have watched tons of replays trying to identify the intentional wreckers, only to find that most collisions are due to poor race craft or lack of racing etiquette. I also know these things can be overcome with practice.
As for the problem being that It’s not real life, and the point of view and sounds prohibit good racing. I would point to iRacing and other racing simulations. The participants in those events are not experiencing what we are in Forza, because they have made a significant commitment in time and money, and there are penalties for poor race craft and lack of racing etiquette. There are lobbies being ran every day in Forza, by skilled players who are not experiencing the carnage seen in most multiplayer lobbies, because they have learned proper race craft and use proper racing etiquette.
The reality is that it’s a commitment issue. Most video gamers are not interested in making a commitment to learn race craft and racing etiquette, because they play multiple types of games, not just racing games. Many move from title to title, farming achievements to boost their gamer score. However, like with every game, there is a core community who rarely play anything else. Those people get faster and faster with each iteration of the game and when new players jump in they are overwhelmed by their inability to keep up. Rather than learn the proper way, they attempt brute force and hope they can get lucky. Very few take the time to learn how to race, how to tune a car or how to respect other drivers on the track. But there are some who genuinely get the racing bug. I know, because I did and so did a lot of people I have met in Forza. It’s those people who I want to reach, because they will be the ones still trying after the next COD releases. And every one of those has the potential to bring friends to the game.
It’s not impossible to improve the online experience. In fact it is inevitable that it WILL improve. I would like to see the community grow along the way. So, I will remain positive, keep enjoying the game, and do my part to steer people to these forums and to information on how to improve.
Hoping that T10 increases reward for good dri icing behavior. Public rewards. Good driving behavior rewards need to be sought after.
and it needs to be displayed in loading screens, etc so everyone can see-- it needs to be focus in SP too. No It’s ok to bash through drivatars— to change the culture you must concentrate on the behavior that you desire. Concentrating on negative behavior yield negative behavior is all I’m saying.
@hippy. i was being sincere. Just incase you took it otherwise.
@x1
Those were just excuses. Yes it’s difficult and can be contributing factors. But if some one disappears from you rear view, If you can not look then it’s pretty safe to assume they are beside you which means hold your line (not racing line) around the turn, until you regain visual.
In real life visibility also poor. It’s all about the decision made with that knowledge. Where did the other car go? What do I do: Race as if they are not there or race as if they are beside you?
I’ve held an outside line around a turn or held inside without tracking out more times then I can count for no reason, simply because I lost track of a car so I assumed they were there until I verified they weren’t.
I am new to enthusiast and could use some help with two issues. In a previous thread some advice on avoiding collisions is to take the inside line. When i take the outside line to allow faster drivers the inside line, invariably they knock me out. I have found that when i take the inside line as advised they either don’t hit me or when they do, i dont fly off the track. So my default is to try to stay inside. However your advice is the opposite of that. Can you perhaps suggest a better approach?
Second i find that the difference seems to be how quickly to recover from a crash. When i get hit it usually spins the car so its facing bacwards, but i notice most other drivers when hit still seems to be somewhat pointing in the right direction. I have no assists and am driving manual with no clutch using a controller. Are there any techniques i can use to help me?
Let me first say that I am not a pro. That’s why I post links to advise from either professional racers or fast players from Forza.
Collisions in Forza are often much different than they are in real life. The way cars react to impacts seems exaggerated intermittently, so how a collision will play out is difficult to estimate.
It has been my experience that, in the first turn, it’s best to try and hold an inside line, m BECAUSE if you do get hit from behind the likelihood of another car keeping you on the track is greater. As the race progresses, and gets up to speed, I tend to move to the outside of corners so I do not block the faster drivers approach to the apex. Unless they say otherwise, that’s usually my plan. If I get hit in those situations, and end up off the track, at least I know I was giving them the best line.
As for your car spinning around after being hit, it depends a lot on how the collision happens. I don’t use any assists either, and I find that releasing the throttle is the first thing I do, followed by either modulated throttling or modulated braking to stabilize my car and get it going in the right direction.
Like I said, I am not a pro, and I am far from being an authority on the subject. I hope this helps, and that some folks with better information can help as well.
There is no panacea for any league division, except that you build a certain stamina that sees you through all the racing mishaps that come your way. Racing online is ha dear now that damage simulator is turned on, so good luck there!
