If the rim size is increased, I would like the brakes to be stronger as well

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1

In the current Forza, even if you increase the size of the rim, the brakes themselves do not change (although if you look at the graphics alone, they may look larger).
Therefore, the weight of the car increases due to the increase in unsprung weight, and the brake value in the game (called stopping power in this thread) decreases.
This is true up to this point, but it is unfortunate that making the rims larger is only for dressing up and reducing performance, and does not lead to an increase in performance.

My proposal is to reflect the improvement of brake performance in the game by adding an option to increase the size of the brakes according to the size of the rims.

In the real world, the high-performance brakes sold by brake manufacturers are usually large, and the rims need to be larger to accommodate them.
In the game, you can replace the rims with race brakes without making them larger, so the order is reversed from reality.

IMPORTANT !!
“Comments that are not related to the topic will not be considered discussion. We will not respond to any replies to comments that are not relevant to the discussion.”

2

I mean true that, but bigger brakes wouldn’t change anything about the stats of the car other than increase weight. I don’t really see why this would be an important addition to the game.

3

Increasing the size of the brakes increases the stopping power. So you’re saying that increased stopping power isn’t important? If you only play drag racing, you’d be right. I want to drive on a track, so I think the stopping power of the brakes is important.

4

Bigger brakes = more weight
If you have race brakes on your car and switch them out for bigger race brakes, it is not stopping you faster.
Increasing rotor size will not decrease the braking distance. If you want to stop faster you’d need better tires.

In real life you’d be partially right, as a bigger brake rotor diameter equals more surface area for the brakes to cool down, which is extremely important in circuit racing. In drag racing that would not be needed, as the brakes are only used once per race. So idk why you bring that up, but ok.
In a race on a track with multiple hard braking zones, better brake cooling gives an ultimate advantage and will lead to better performance over a long race.

So now lets talk about how bigger rotor size would affect the cars in Forza

In Forza brake temperature is not simulated, so therefore brake cooling is obsolete.
Considering race brakes in Forza have the same stats as real life carbon-ceramic brakes, you wouldn’t need an upgrade over race brakes as it physically couldn’t get better.

So, as I said, it wouldn’t make a significant difference.

5

Increasing the brake size will increase the pad size and the stopping power.

If what you are saying is correct, then all cars should be fine with the smallest brake size, because you said there is no big difference in stopping power. How about Japanese Kei-Car small brakes? Please try it at your own risk in your real car. If the engine is upgraded and the car is significantly heavier, the situation becomes even more ideal.
I refuse to conduct such experiments, and I will not be responsible for the results of any actual tests you conduct. All expenses and damages incurred in the experiment must be borne by you.

6

IF what I say is correct?
I thought it’s common knowledge that brakes transform rotational momentum into heat and therefore heat dissipation is one of the most important characteristics of race car brakes


I don’t know what to say to this.
Here is a video, maybe it helps your confusion:

Also stop saying “stopping power”, that is a term that doesn’t mean anything.

7

I don’t know who made this video, but have a look at the brake manufacturer’s website. It clearly states that brake size is one of the important factors. It took me just a minute to get to this website, probably less time than it took you to make your weird reply.

Brembo - Official Website

8

Let’s reorganize the problem and fix 1.

In the current Forza, even if you increase the size of the rim, the brakes themselves do not change (although if you look at the graphics alone, they may look larger).
Therefore, the weight of the car increases due to the increase in unsprung weight, and the brake value in the game (called stopping power in this thread) decreases.
This is true up to this point, but it is unfortunate that making the rims larger is only for dressing up and reducing performance, and does not lead to an increase in performance.

My proposal is to reflect the improvement of brake performance in the game by adding an option to increase the size of the brakes according to the size of the rims.

In the real world, the high-performance brakes sold by brake manufacturers are usually large, and the rims need to be larger to accommodate them.
In the game, you can replace the rims with race brakes without making them larger, so the order is reversed from reality.

9

Just install race brakes and increase the brake pressure. I use abs off and 160% brake pressure on a controller. Sports brakes too I think you can adjust. Not sure. This will increase the stopping power. They will engage almost instantly with very little trigger pressure.

10

This is a thread where I wrote a request for “I want the performance to reflect the result of increasing the brake radius according to the rim size.” I don’t understand the intention of your reply at all. No one other than you is talking about brake controllers.

11

One other person replied other than me
 Perhaps they don’t know that. Been playing since Forza 1 bud. ABS off. No assists. It will brake harder if you increase the brake pressure and you will stop faster but you need to install sports or race brakes. This is with ABS off. I haven’t had them on since Forza 6 so I’m not sure this applies for ABS on. I set it to 100% brake pressure I can’t slow the car the way I want for a corner but 160% is fine. Pretty obvious what I’m trying to tell you. Rim size with increased brake pad size isn’t a thing in Forza. It’s not a true sim like Assetto Corsa or iRacing. We call it simcade. Why don’t you try my suggestion and see. If it makes it stop better what does it matter how big they are if you get the same result? You say performance was reduced, this should help that. It may not be a perfect solution but it’s better than nothing. It’s not like it will take very long to test it. I highly doubt they are going to do what you’re asking. You know the deal. I can’t even get a rear view mirror in Horizon in hood cam and I’m asking for 10 years. I got votes on that too. What’s a brake controller? I’m using a controller not a wheel and brake pedal. If you are using an actual brake pedal I wouldn’t know. I’m sure it would feel different. That’s why I said that. How about don’t bite the head off someone trying to help you. One of two that replied. It’s an odd question. I’ve never heard anyone ask that and I’ve been on this forum a very long time. The date it shows my joining is not correct.

12

The following sentence was added to 1.
“Comments that are not related to the topic will not be considered discussion. We will not respond to any replies to comments that are not relevant to the discussion.”

13

Ok after taking a big break from this nonsense, I have returned.

I took a look at the website and after translating it, I understand now what you mean, so let’s actually reorganize this and sum up:

“stopping power” doesn’t exist.
→ This is a thing you made up.

You can improve brake performance by increasing rotor size and brake pad, as the brakes will cool down faster and you will be able to brake harder. I Forza brake temperature is not simulated, therefore increasing rotor size in-game wouldn’t change the brake distance, nor the performance over a given time span.
→ Your suggestion has no basis.

In- game “Race Brakes” are simulated as carbon ceramic brakes and “Sport Brakes” are simulated as steel race brakes. If you upgrade from Stock or Street to Sport, you will notice a increase in rotor size, which aligns with reality.
→ Your statement is wrong.

No, you just don’t understand physics.

No, drag racing cars need insane braking performance, as those cars need to stop hundreds of km/h within a very short distance.
→ Your statements is wrong.

“brake size” means what? Do you mean rotor size? Or caliper size? Can you please at least learn the basic vocabulary before you talk about a topic?
→ Duolingo is disappointed in you.

That’s called a strawman argument. I said, “If you have race brakes on your car and switch them out for bigger race brakes, it is not stopping you faster”, then you said, “If what you are saying is correct, then all cars should be fine with the smallest brake size, because you said there is no big difference in stopping power”, which is not what I said.
→ You’re a strawman.

Well, maybe just go onto the youtube channel and see for yourself. You can learn a lot about cars, manufacturing, physics etc. .
→ please educate yourself.

Ok, let’s go then:
(I translated the website with google, from Japanese to English, some words might be wrong, but the overall context should be right)

“1.) Size”
“[
] The larger the disc diameter, the higher the braking torque. [
]”
In the first paragraph the website explains how the rotor size is one of the most important parts when it comes to effective braking torque. The bigger the rotor = the higher the torque = the stronger the tire lockup.
→ It is a law in Japan, the EU, the US and multiple other countries, that the stock manufacturer brakes of the car, no matter what car it is, NEED to be able to lock up the tires completely. So therefore, if you increase the rotor size and no other component changes, the performance of the car will also not change.
The manufacturer Brembo, does not state anywhere on this website that this shortens the braking distance.

Let’s continue:
“[
]The larger the pad area, the easier it is to dissipate heat, so the braking system is less likely to lose power [
]”
→ Brake temperature is not simulated in Forza. Therefore a bigger brake pad wouldn’t change anything in the game.

It then goes on about other components that are important.

I the next paragraph the website mentions “stopping power”:
“[
]These are combined with large diameter high performance discs to create a braking system with excellent rigidity and stopping power.[
]”
→ This is a translation error, due to it being translated. In the Japanese original they called it ćˆ¶ć‹•ćŠ›. The first part of the word â€œćˆ¶â€ means as much as “regulation” or “control” and the second part “拕抛” means something like “dynamic power” or “force”. This is the Japanese word for “braking force” or “braking power”.
Why can you not refer to “braking force” as “stopping power”? Aren’t those two words with the same meaning?
No, stopping power is a term used in in nuclear and materials physics that specifically refers to the decelerating force acting on charged particles, typically alpha and beta particles, due to interaction with matter, resulting in loss of particle kinetic energy. (source: Wikipedia)

“2) Lightweight (best balance between weight and rigidity)”
In this part they just say how amazingly light their products are and that carbon ceramic brakes are lighter that steel brakes. Because of the lighter weight they can increase the rotor size without loosing performance.
→ In-game we already have carbon ceramic brakes called “Race Brakes”. If we increase their rotor and brake pad size, it will cause the car’s unsprung mass to increase, which in turn will lower the cars performance.

The rest of the paragraphs they talk about the surface of the rotor and pads and how more grip causes higher braking torque and how that changes the initial grip of the pads and therefore shortens the brake distance as there is faster engagement.
And then they talk about some marketing and how amazing their approach is and their amazing science foundation.

TLDR: Brembo makes good brakes.

Yeah, think about that. Maybe you should spend a bit more time into your research.

Ok, to sum this up:
Your understanding of basic physics isn’t deep enough. You don’t understand how car brakes work and neither how the game simulates brakes.
If you increase the rotor size in a car, it increases the weight, which reduces the overall performance of the car as brake temperature is not simulated in Forza. Therefore you either have to reduce the weight of the brake system or increase the performance of the brake system by eg. increasing the initial grip of the brake pad when first touching the rotor, in other words → increase engagement. When upgrading from Sport (steel) to Race (carbon ceramic) brakes the brake system looses weight and increases engagement and therefore increases the performance of the car. This is realistic.
If you want to have a feature in the game where you can change the diameter of the brake rotor for aesthetic reasons, that’s fine. This will not decrease the brake distance.

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