I’m using the default controller that was included with my Xbox Series X.
1 Like
Forza horizon 5 special edition controller
1 Like
I’ve been using a standard Xbox wireless controller, Xbox Series S
Sorry for the late response, thanks for looking into this.
The developers have investigated this and determined this is by design. The shifting mechanic has been updated in Forza Motorsport from Forza Motorsport 7 to increase authenticity. When using Manual with Clutch shifting, the clutch must be at least partially disengaged while the transmission shifts. The action of changing gears takes a fraction of a second. If you fail to release the throttle or engage the clutch before the shift is complete you will damage the transmission when simulation damage is enabled.
3 Likes
Hm, I don’t know about this. This really should only apply if you’re controlling an H-pattern shifting car sequentially on a controller or with paddles, as you’re technically sending a command to a virtual driver to physically make the shift happen.
Shifting sequentially without disengaging the clutch input on a car that actually shifts sequentially shouldn’t damage the transmission, as the shifts are being controlled as intended.
And in the case of direct selection using an H-pattern shifter, there should be zero shifting delay on the input, because us physically changing the shifter position is the delay that’s being simulated when shifting with sequential inputs. When my shifter is in 3rd gear, it should not be sending a virtual command to tell the driver to shift to 3rd gear; the car should just be in 3rd gear.
It seriously pains a lot of us that we have to put race transmissions into cars in this game just to be able to shift as we do normally in our real life economy beaters without shredding the transmission in 5 minutes.
2 Likes
I cannot fully agree with this conclusion. For a good amount of the reported cars this okay, but for some cars that have been reported it doesn’t make sense.
Going through this thread there are several cars that have this issue that do not use a clutch when shifting and therefor shouldn’t get damage when you do the same. A good example of these cars are the Forza P1 cars but there are more.
4 Likes
I’m not sure this is the issue I first brought up to the question.
Certain cars, not all cars receive engine damage when shifting in the ‘Manual’ or ‘Manual with Clutch’ options while simulation damage is active.
Most, if not all race cars in the game shift without using clutch while using the ‘Manual with Clutch’ setting, and most do not get engine damage by doing this. But there are a few that do, I believe it’s mostly because of the automatic revmatching spiking the revs to ping off the rev limiter in most of these instances but I’m not sure.
Considering as I remember this would happen shifting while using the clutch or not, as well as in the Manual setting with no clutch on the Toyota TS040, which would receive between 4-8% engine damage each lap at Spa-Francorchamps, in either setting. I don’t believe that this is part of the designed function.
Thank You though for looking into it, I am glad to see that these are being looked into.
1 Like
Thanks for investigating this, but I would like you to please investigate this further.
I know that the shifting mechanic was updated from Forza Motorsport 7, because I noticed it as soon as I played the new Forza Motorsport, but please take a look at the following reasons that explain why this issue is not about this new shifting mechanic:
- This issue also happens when using Manual without Clutch and Automatic shifting.
- This issue also happens when the clutch is fully disengaged multiple seconds before the actual downshift button is pressed.
- This issue is causing engine damage, not transmission damage. Engine damage is only the effect caused by too much rev-matching / throttle auto-blip.
- This issue only affects some cars, but the new shifting mechanic is present in most cars and most noticeable in cars with slower transmissions.
- Many of the affected cars are race cars that already have the fastest race transmissions installed and therefore should not be affected by the new shifting mechanic (at all or only to a small extent).
- This issue only happens when downshifting, the new shifting mechanic also affects upshifting.
- If only cosmetic damage is enabled, there obviously is no engine damage, but when downshifting there is still too much rev-matching / throttle auto-blip.
If you need further information or additional video footage to fix this please ask here and I will try my best to help you. I want to drive many of the affected cars, but for me it is very annoying to have the engine rev thousands of RPM higher than it should or even straight into the limiter every time I downshift.
3 Likes
Happens when using just manual…
Manual H pattern shifter. Logitech G920.
Manual transmission doesn’t work - it makes absolutely no sense.
Real cars do not work like this - how do I know?
Well I’ve driven plenty of H pattern cars for many years without ever breaking an engine, transmission, clutch etc…
But in Forza - I can manage approximately 3 low speed corners and the car needs towing to the pits.
2 Likes
This is truly atrocious.
As others have mentioned, for users with a wheel, pedals, and importantly a shifter; the person is shifting the gears. This artificial wait for the game to decide enough time has passed to be ‘in gear’ makes no sense whatsoever when my shifter has been in that gear for some time already…
Come on T10, you’re doing great work with changing CXP and CP, but clutch is completely broken in this game, and it needs a fix if you want your player base to return.
Of the games I have played on my Xbox:
Assetto Corsa gets it right.
Project Cars 2 gets it right.
Dirt Rally 2 gets it right.
EA WRC gets it right.
Forza Horizons all get it right.
Forza Motorsports other than '23 gets it right.
Forza Motorsport '23 does not get clutching right.
That said, your response is also to the wrong problem, and the issue identified by the OP is something quite different.
Please look at it all again.
4 Likes
For anyone following this thread, the issue with clutch delay has been fixed for users of a wheel, H pattern shifter and pedals. - Big win for wheel users - Thank you to the developer that went in and re-coded it!
A delay still exists for clutching on a controller - This part seems to be ‘by design’ as mentioned by JetPartySalad above, to slow down the clutch & shift ‘flick’ method on a controller. I personally still think this is a horrible band-aid to even out multiplayer, it introduces a jarring minigame during racing (‘guess the shifting minimum time.’…) and people who were capable of the ‘flick’ should just be permitted to go faster; anyone else can learn it if they want.
Unsure if the OP issue about transmission damage in certain circumstances still exists.
It is good that they fixed the other issue, but this thread is about engine damage and it still exists with update 5.0.
3 Likes
The 1999 Toyota #3 Toyota Motorsports GT-ONE TS020 does not have this issue when stock, but once you remove the restrictor plate / increase the air flow the car does too much rev-matching.
The first upgrade increases the rev-matching by approximately 500 RPMs, the second upgrade by around 2000 RPMs.
2 Likes
As discovered in the other thread the rev-matching increases to 1500 RPMs for the first upgrade and to 4500 RPMs for the second restrictor plate upgrade of the Toyota TS020 if using manual instead of manual with clutch.
If it is by design, then please update the transmission physics or behaviour for downshifting, because no car IRL, stock or modified, blips the throttle all the way to redline on downshifts.
It doesn’t matter if I’m at 3k revs or 5k revs, my car assuming has a redline of 9-9.5k will STILL auto-blip the throttle all the way to redline when downshifting. It’s bizarre and sounds really weird too as if the driver is trying to rev the engine or something rather than simply do a “blip” to rev match.
Please investigate further until the downshifting behaviour sounds correct.
1 Like
As far as Xbox goes, it’s happening on normal manual on controller. I haven’t tried manual with clutch.
The downshifting behavior simply isn’t correct for many cars. For example, IRL, a driver would never blip the throttle so high on downshifts that the needle practically touches redline. This is precisely the issue right now on controller using regular manual (no clutch).
Just drive the Skyline VSpec II or Carerra GT to get an idea. I think one of the AMs, the Valkyrie, also has this issue.
1 Like
Same with the Supra after applying full mods. The auto throttle blip on downshifts sends the rpm all the way to redline. How odd.
Bump
The consumption racers event
The #17 Porsche is bouncing off the revs on downshifts regardless of speed or revs
To note: restrictor plate removed upgrade (in case it matters)
Xsx
Latest FM update
Original xsx controller
Manual shifting
Video:
Ignore my terrible driving, watch the revs blip to the heavens on downshifts - the chicane in particular, 70km and into 3rd should not do that
2 Likes
This issue makes the Silverstone endurance race painful with the Toyota #8
Hops off the limiter on downshifts no matter what speed or revs causing engine damage.
It’s not a feature and if it’s by design, it’s woeful design
1 Like