I really don’t care about content. I’ve always been a quality over quantity car game guy or whatever. From a technical standpoint, the physics, audio, and visuals were incredible at the time. They exploited the Xbox One really well.
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Which is why FM4, to this day is held in such high regard: it has both. FM5 may be pretty to look at, but in terms of car selection, track selection, game modes, and just general “stuff to do”, it pales in comparison to every other game in the series. In fact, many people (myself included) feel that, before 8 came along, 5 was the low point of the series.
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I see this bounced around a lot, particularly around FPS fandoms like Halo and Call of Duty. Not once has anyone who has ever championed this thesis ever stopped to ask themselves, “I wonder what that says about the state of the franchise.”
Having played the last two Call of Duty entries, I am going to confidently and succinctly say that Modern Warfare III is probably the worst game I’ve suffered through in more than a decade. It is a game made explicitly for the TikTok generation, and I mean that in the most derogatory sense of the descriptor. And somehow, Black Ops 6 doubled down on everything wrong about Modern Warfare III - so much so, in fact, that I noped all the way out after the beta, and uninstalled everything save for MWII.
The idea that MWIII or Black Ops 6 could be viewed fondly in the future is a stark indictment of how far Call of Duty has not only fallen, but bored into the ground at Mach 12. And frankly, the idea that Forza Motorsport 2023 could be looked at fondly should be regarded the same exact way. If Forza Motorsport receives new entries and those entries are capable of making people yearn for 2023…I don’t think anyone on this forum can truly understand the levels of catastrophic failure necessary to reach that point. Not even myself.
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Forza 5 was horrible.
Crappy menu’s, crappy stats, crappy career.
But all of those flaws are still better than Forza 23.
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I could return that argument in your face and say I don’t see a lot of people stop to ask themselves whether it’s actually the thing they used to like that has changed, or whether it’s them and their tastes that have changed, or a little bit of both. Especially when you consider humans have a natural tendency to resist change, plus a natural tendency to fall into nostalgia biases, unreliable memory, and various other biases.
Beyond that, “the state of the franchise” doesn’t evoke much to me. It’s not a measurable, objective thing, it’s a feeling. That feeling could be wrong. But also, that feeling could be misplaced. Maybe the franchise has changed, but maybe it would have changed in the exact same way if it was still the exact same people working on it. Art doesn’t exist in a vacuum.
At the end of the day, wondering about “the state of the franchise” gets you nowhere useful. I can tell you what I like about FM23. I can tell you what I don’t like about it. What some other games did before doesn’t change that.
The thing this vid does right - it highlights one of the few big problems with FM8 visuals:
- use of TAA or its analogue instead of MSAA which is the cause of this blurry effect of the fine objects
but, more important. - incorrect use of ambient occlusion and color correction\color scheme → this is why everything looks duller and kinda flatter than it used to be, because purely on the technical side, cars in FM8 have higher level of detail, but the presentation ruins it.
but my biggest gripe with FM8 graphics is not even ambient occlusion, is the use of volumetric clouds instead of, but not in tandem with, parallax ones. I honestly don’t think the sky in FM8 is realistic or pretty at all, on the contrary, it looks like a downgrade. FM7, FM6 (both have dynamic\parallax clouds) and even FM5 (has static skybox) skies are much more pleasant to look at. For all i know, T10 could just use parallax + RTAO, or even GTAO, and it would work just fine, better than what we have now at the very least.
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No, but it shouldn’t be judged as if it does, either.
Something or certain elements of something can appeal to me, but the fact remains that it has to be judged accordingly and objectively both by itself and in comparison to what it follows. What people who consistently bring up the so-called “COD cycle” don’t understand or fail to acknowledge that it’s not a cycle. It’s a trend. And a downward sloping trend at that.
I reiterate - if there are future installments of the Motorsport franchise and they inspire nostalgic feelings for this game…what has gone wrong? What has badly gone wrong? That’s the point. Think about all of the other entries up to this point, and how Forza Motorsport 2023 stacks up to them as a whole. And then think about the scenario that exists for a future entry that makes people go, “Man, I miss Forza Motorsport 2023.”
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What I’m hearing under everything there is you don’t like this game. Which is fine, but also it’s not a universal, objective feeling. If people feel nostalgic about something you don’t/didn’t like, that doesn’t automatically something went wrong or changed.
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There are many ways to objectively measure it, and when compared over time across installments, all those data points create a downward-sloping trend-line after FM4.
…That’s not nostalgia - it’s recognition of a decline.
“Those who don’t learn from history are doomed to repeat it. …And those who do learn from history are doomed to watch everyone else repeat it.”
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While there’s always going to be some subjective stuff when it comes to a series, I think FM is one where there’s more objective comparisons to be made than most.
They’re all track based racing games that basically do the same thing, so content, features and graphics are the main differentiators imo.
I actually think FM5’s quality in some regards is underrated, but the lack of content and features compared to FM4 really hurt it.
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…I think you’re arguing just to be a devil’s advocate now. We can debate feelings and nostalgia all day long, but when it comes to where Forza Motorsport 2023 stands, that matter has been settled. The general consensus is that this entry is a low point in the franchise. The lowest point? Possibly - that can be debated. But no one is going to step up to the microphone and unironically say that this is what the franchise should be. There’s plenty of tangible evidence supporting that.
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I think on technical levels, presentation and at the time being the only game to launch on xbox one that could rival ps4 performance, the game was an actual built from the near ground up next gen racing game.
Obviously it was missing a lot of the content and features from fm4, but what content it did have was top notch at the time. I think everyone was disappointed, but it was a relatively popular game, it sold well enough and the people stuck around.
I think this game obviously missed the mark on presentation and performance. Content is less than fm7, but it has fm5 beat on launch content. Id say the tracks were done well, but the cars not so much.
The graphical techniques used in this game would be best described as inconsistent. At times things can look fine and then the tracks disappear, the interior of the cars start to shimmer. Some things have been adjusted, the game looks better overall, but realistically the changes have been minimal.
I think fm5 for being a launch title for a new console, having a 2 year turnaround was a pretty solid game. Not as good as fm4, but still felt like the people making it actually liked cars and played racing games. It also established a new base for future titles to expand on.
This game wasnt a launch title, it took 2-3 times as long to make and imo isnt a solid foundation to build on as they can barely add anything to it now. Usually reboots are kind of like a side step to their forebears, but this one felt like a step back in most ways.
I think on my list of best forza motorsports, fm8 would be last. It has the most issues, the worst game design, only a handful of new things added but only a fingers worth that work properly. I think it has dealt a significant blow to peoples confidence in this franchise and unfortunately it may never recover.
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Forza Motorsport 5 is not a master piece graphically yes but the lack of tracks and cars including missing features left much to be desired when i got the game FM5 i was amazed by the Level of detail on the cars & tracks & then when FM6 came out it just got better then something was seriously wrong with the tyre model & handling physics in FM7 & the games lighting was horrible & the constant garage stuttering FM4 is the Best because the tyre model and handling physics is far superior than all of motorsport 5 6 7 23 combined that’s my opinion of course but if you try the game FM 4 its a big difference not only FM4 buy 3 & 2 as well
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I know and we all know that this is being talked since release but I haven’t watched this video and Forza Motorsport 5 looks great on this video, I’ve played all of motorsport and horizon forzas. We all know that the best Forza is Motorsport 4. But all I want is this game makes a huge huge comeback and shut my mouth and for some others for good. I really wish T10 improve more graphics and pay more attention to details because details matter and to me Wich I’m very open eye to this stuff I love graphics I love to sit at 4K TV and be overwhelmed with visuals but also gameplay. They can have access to other platforms like PS or PC they can play other games and see the difference and compare stuff, of course needs to have its DNA but man be more respectful towards the players who are loyal to the Forza franchise. Sometimes it hurts when I see some responses from moderators saying that it won’t be fixed some issues …
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The team That made 2,3,4 are long gone , And I don’t think we’ll ever have the quality in this new forza that we had in the older ones. It’s a different generation of people developing this game. And I don’t think they know anything about the older games on how they were made and the assets that were used.
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Yeah I’m starting to think like that. Passion for cars is gone, attention to details is gone. It’s like a game made by woke people
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Is that a lot of anti-woke assumption? Generations don’t determine quality or game play features. The different generations at iRacing, ACC, Gran Turismo, etc continue to improve, but they make sure they are eyes wide open woke to what matters, quality, intelligent science and engineering practices, and educated growth as shown in their developer presentations. Culture priorities drive outcomes.
Have you seen the Sophy AI that taught itself driving and drifts in nearly inconceivable ways?
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Might be true for those games but definitely not this version of Forza and Ive been playing racing games since Grand turismo 1.
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It seems the culture and priorities drove the outcome in all cases, no? Just as it has since long before Gran Turismo 1, Back before the Papyrus/Indy 500 era even, a decade before GT, and to this very minute of updates/fixes/patches and bugs.
Whatever it may be it hasn’t Benefit us in this version of forza. I continue to play Forrza 7 because the game play is just that much better. And there continues to be an ample amount of people still playing online in multiplayer
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