Once i got used to shifting I’d say manual w/clutch is not just tenths faster it is literally several seconds faster on all tracks… Class b mostly for me. I did try to beat my auto tranny times at class r and that is a lot harder at that level which is expected.
Again. For me it is preference. I use the e brake with the a button. Always have, I am used to having it there to catch myself on a tight corner and such. As far as i am concerned, I still think if I spend the PI there shouldn’t be a difference to the degree there is in manual vs manual with clutch. Auto, yes, just isn’t close.
When I did a straightline test on Forza Motosport 4 Manual with Clutch was a few tenths faster in a B/500 car over 800m than Manual, and almost a full second faster than Automatic. The difference in a non-production car was smaller.
I’ll have to re-test in the future but having used Manual with Clutch for years now I won’t be changing anytime soon.
See, that’s the thing right there. For me it is the way I have played all through every forza. Just manual, no clutch. Everything else is always off. I am just used to it. My only issue/point is that as I have gotten talking to people on these here forums, there are many that are faster, that use manual, with clutch and tell me that the upgrade for clutch is a waste of PI, don’t do it. Well, if I choose to use the PI, I should be just as fast as those folks using manual with clutch un upgraded. Clutches aren’t used in drag with the transmissions they use, it’s bump shifters, alot like supercars paddle shifters. Nascar drivers don’t use the clutch going through the gears on a road course.
I know I am in the minority with this whole clutch, no clutch thing. I have said before that I enjoy the game more not having to use it and I know I will be slower because of it. I am only saying that in alot of instances, it shouldn’t make THAT much of a difference. My tiny, lonely little opinion, haha.
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Looks like there are 2 separate discussions going on here.
Regarding assists, see my previous post.
As for the Clutch upgrade options, I personally don’t bother with them unless I have the PI to spare on a build, and have already fully upgraded my Driveline, Wheel Rims, Flywheel and a number of other options. Those 2-3 points of PI can be put to better use elsewhere.
When I tested the cars were stock, you’ll have to re-test with upgraded Clutches as I was only looking at the Assist in a vacuum.
That is a very unfair test for manual without clutch for 2 major reasons and should really be considered an invalid test as a result. 1. Most vehicles have “poor” trans and clutch combos stock highly favoring clutch use anyways as clutch doesn’t benefit from the increased shift times that come with upgrading the trans and clutch whereas manual alone will greatly. 2. You are using that test to claim that clutch saves time over no clutch with upgraded cars much less using it as a rule of thumb to go by. Your test is only valid for racing with stock vehicles and in that situation of course clutch is going to be better more than 90% of the time. With a fully upgraded clutch and trans you are gaining about .15 to .23 seconds total in shift time depending upon the vehicle. I would think that significant enough to at least warrant a test with just fully upgraded trans+clutch combo with both manual and manual clutch. Only then can you fairly say that one is definitively better, faster, what have you than the other especially when you are talking about using as a rule to go by or when talking about upgraded vehicles.
Well, I spent most of the day driving with the clutch. Kept it on the left shoulder, not switched to A. Mostly I wanted to get used to it because I have been having alot of fun drag racing. It’s not as bad as I have made it out to be. I still feel like, with the tech that is out there these days, using a “clutch” shouldn’t be as dominant as it is compared to just manual. I can see auto, but not manual. Just my opinion.
In drag racing as. PRKid mentioned there are instances where manual is quicker than manual w clutch. I would imagine it would apply to circuit cars as well. Almost always 4wd converted cars do better w manual than w manual and clutch. Check the leaderboards in forza 5 the awd p class leaderboard car (alpha stradale) everybody used manual because it was quicker.
If I remember correctly even some rwd cars respond better to manual without clutch. An example in forza 5 would be the Ferrari 458, I believe it was a paddle shifter car… If I remember correctly factory paddle shift cars respond better to manual… Just thought of another example the lotus e23.
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Oh come on!! Lol! So I spent the last couple days, switching to the darkside, using clutch!! And now, now we’re saying it sometimes doesn’t matter! Haha, just messin’. I will say, when I can get the shift right, it’s a touch quicker. I left it on the shoulder button, felt kinda like shifting a motorcycle.maybe at this point they have actually programmed for the new, double clutch, electronic, crazy fast paddle shift gearbox tech. I dont know. I’m not really sold one way or the other. It was fun today, other than the time or 2 that I was holding the clutch instead of the brake going into the hairpins, haha.
I’m not sure good question i also want to know that
Their’s no point debating its common knowledge that manual with clutch is faster. It always has been and that’s the reason everyone uses it. Using the clutch also gives you the option to cause clutch on/off oversteer, which is often useful but the true benefit is the speed boost you gain especially in the lower classes. When all the top drivers dump the clutch because manual alone is faster I’ll follow suit.
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This is the correct answer as to why people use Manual with Clutch. You get added control to manually induce oversteer when needed, along with a small “kick” every time you shift on a straight.
In any class below R/900 it’s obvious when you’re racing against somebody who doesn’t use Manual with Clutch as you’ll suddenly gain a few feet every time you upshift.
It doesn’t matter if real cars can shift faster/slower with certain transmission setups, this is a game and in order to win races you need to play to the game’s physical tendencies and not “real ones”.
I only do Circuit Racing so I can’t talk much about Drag performance.
As for AWD, depending on the circuit and class you will occasionally see AWD/FWD set good times but almost all of the Top 100 times I see are set with RWD cars.
By using Manual with Clutch you also qualify for the Hardcore leaderboards, but given the large number of people that rely on the Driving Line assist for their brake markers that’s a bit of a moot point.
Currently in f6 the ford coupe awd is leading in the s class leaderboards (manual) and the alpha stradale awd is leading the p class lb (manual)
One of the reasons is hardly anyone drag races or knows of the leaderboards for it. A top driver whom clutch slips should beat the same tune run with manual only. That’s a fact I have witnessed not a guess
Look at the f5 leaderboards same with 6. On test track there’s so much traction clutch slipping isn’t faster than an awd with manual. All the guys that slip even use it in the awd cars. That’s a fact. Now maybe on Hockenheim or Sonoma in forza 6 there may be an advantage to slippin, but with everybody using tcs it’s doubtful.
But after you’re in a steady speed, manual without clutch is slower. Drag does not equal circuit. I think maybe the slowest you’ll go is around 40 mph so there’s minimal issues.
Drag is a bit limited anyways. If you had full reign in tuning the car and the build options were increased, things may be different.
I’m not debating if clutch is faster or not. I’m questioning the backing behind why someone says it is. I am playing devils advocate regarding the method someone uses to say it is. I started driving clutch for 2 reasons. 1. It would be cool. 2. It should make someone faster if what was said was true and it pretty much is. That being said I started to wonder if my issues with clutch button operation was actually still faster than if I just used manual. Turned out my issues regarding clutch button operation was actually slowing me down by tenths on a regular basis on the relatively smaller tracks that I tested. Thus for me clutch was slowing me down. If I tested on bigger tracks the difference would become more exaggerated due to more shifting. That makes me a rare exception. The rule that clutch is faster is a rule to go by because it is true. There are a few videos out there with transmission and clutch upgrades applied that demonstrate that, so long as you can efficiently operate the clutch button, clutch is faster than manual. Those videos were not Forza 6 fyi I will admit. I have yet to see one for F6 but I also have yet to even look.
Again all I was doing was playing devils advocate over someones reason as to why they stood by it. I was not debating if clutch was faster or not. Never was and until someone good with the clutch does a test showing with transmission and clutch upgrades applied that clutch is no longer faster I will still believe that clutch is faster. When new people can see a post saying clutch is faster based upon completely stock tests it isn’t exactly a good thing. You are saying the right thing but in the very wrong way. Many people don’t care regarding stock because many people, especially new people, don’t race stock often if at all thus it doesn’t apply and is a waste of time of a test not to mention that manual without clutch shifts a lot faster after you upgrade the clutch and transmission fully. If you want to give a reason as to why clutch is better (beyond using the arbitrary better players do excuse by giving an example that holds more relevance than the arbitrary excuse) you have to do it in a manner in which manual is at the best it can possibly be while minimizing any other differences.
Edit: Double post. Sorry.
Leaderboards don’t lie… For straight line acceleration in an awd car manual is always faster. You can check f5 leaderboards and f6 leaderboards (if u could see them) everybody at the top of the lb is using manual. Now for rwd cars yes manual w clutch is faster. I can’t speak for circuit leaderboards, but my guess is there are no awd cars on circuit leaderboards.