While trying to create a livery for my Datsun 510 to be used in an upcoming series, I noticed that only 3 manufacturer logos were available to select, the turn 10 logo as well as the 2 forza motorsports 6 logos, none of the other 40 logos show up to be used. I’m not sure if this is the only car affected, however I know that I’m not the only person affected as one of my friends is experiencing the same issue.
1 Like
Mate, I was just doing my datsun510 sedan, and yes, there’s absolutely NO manufactures decals available. Nothing other than the Sharefront, which then “locks” your design, ebven if you just use a simple Bridgestone decal… Bloody stupid if you ask me. Not even the official Datsun logo decal… Forza 3 had all the manurfacters decals that were available as engine/car upgrades. So if you installed a certain wheel combo, the official manurfacters decal was avail.
Right down to in tack manifolds, suspension manufactures etc etc.
If I create the Datsun logo, and make it readily avail, if some uses it, and I don’t care if “I created it” that poor person that wants to use it, automatically gets their design locked and is unable to share it with friends etc.
This could be one of the silliest ideas MS/Turn 10 have done since FM3…
Edit: to OP, I’ll be taking some pics once I’ve finished the paintwork mate, so feel free to check out my pics via shared photos etc, I’ll chase up your gamer tag as well to check yours out.
My son has a Datsun 1200 ute with a 1600 fitted with twin 42mm Webers, and painted a deep shade of Lime Green duck. He’s a motor trimmer, so he’s made a nifty ,bed cover with Datsun logo on it, as well as done a complete custom retrim on the ute.
1 Like
Why if I were the person who created the vinyl want you to profit from using my said logo? Locking a design for using someone elses vinyl is a good thing.
I personally wouldn’t care whether someone else used my designs as credits aren’t hard to come by and I don’t care if someone else makes a few thousand with a design that used one of my vinyls. Also for the group I’m involved in races with, some of the events require a number board or other vinyl to be included on the car and currently we need to make a step by step list for how to create it when if it were open then the participants could download the design and be fine. Overall, I think that the creator should be given the option to lock the design if they would like to but if they don’t care then they could leave it open and this applies to anything shared on forza, even, or in my eyes especially, for tunes for which each person has there own driving style and should have a tune that fits it.
3 Likes
Totally agree mate. In iterations up to and including FM 1-3, we had the option to ‘lock’ anything we created, be it a complete racing livery, a ‘vynil’ group, tune or anything else for that matter.
But now, if you or I recreate a simple logo, it becomes locked, and anyone that simply wants to use a commonly known manurfacters to create their own livery that I or anyone recreates, it in turns becomes locked by default. Thus not allowing others to use the livery, in say some league or competition or special interest group.
There needs to be a myriad of manurfacters commonly used logos that are used in the game, made available to users of the game, such as was the case in FM1-3.
I createed an exact copy of Jason Brights 2010-12 Tradingpost V8SC Holden. It was put up on the then known ‘Storefront’ and well over 20-30ppl downloaded the entire livery for use in their game. And I didn’t mind one bit.
Sure, I got credits for it that helped boost my credits level, but it was great knowing others are using the livery to race a copy of Jason Brights Holden around say Bathurst. I was happy, the user was happy, and even Jason Bright was happy when he say the livery racing around in the game.
You’re (read generic ‘you’re’) simply recreating an ‘existing registered trade name’ if you’re just copying a real world trademark.
In fact, the logo you create (read copy) is NOT actually yours to lay claim to, it is in fact the companies legitimate trademark, and by copying it in the first instance, it is a breach of worldwide pattern and trademark law.
So ‘ideally’ it would be in MS/Turn 10s best interest to supply legitimate trademark logos so that their userbase is NOT committing a crime by copying said trademark, say such as copying a Bridgestone logo or say a Hurst or ‘any’ companies trademark for that matter.
If I create a copy of a common logo, such as those mentioned above, I do NOT own or have the ‘rights’ to it. In fact, I’m breaking the basic ‘Copyright laws’ that exist around the globe.
If we however, create something ‘unique’ that did not represent any known company etc, we DO then own the rights to it. But like most graphic artists that have spent the years learning the craft, know that what they create for their own use, not commissioned by a company, belongs yo them.
But like many, they share their work online for nothing other than to have their work seen around the globe. If you read the basic ‘copyright laws’, you’ll see that if you copy something that actually belongs to ANY company, you are actually the one committing the crime initially.
Surely those of use that have the skills to recreate a company logo for use by the general players in Forza, we should not be the one that has the rights to stop other from sing it.
If on the other hand, you create something unique, and choose not to share it. Then by all means, lock it so that no one else can use it.
And how can anyone in a game make real-world $$ from using someone’s design, unique or otherwise.
Simply be open to sharing what you create, the rewards that you receive will be very rewarding from those that you ‘allow’ to use your end product.
I personally would welcome with open hands anyone yet wanted to share something I created, unique or otherwise, so long as they acknowledge my work.
This seems to be the only car I’ve seen affected and luckily I don’t have a teammate that needs this livery so I was able to use the logos in the sharefront but it seems strange that it works for most cars but not this one (and maybe a few others that haven’t been found)
There’s a whole thread about this in the paint forums…
To OP, just finished making a copy of a Datsun manufactures local vinyle set, so please feel free to do a search for my GT, and remember, just check it out and feel free to “USE IT FREELY” (anyone), plus check out pics of finished car in my pics section. I should have them up there soon-ish…
While I agree wholeheartedly that choice and the option to lock or not is better, why not be given the option, I do have to say that nobody should be forced to have their liveries unlocked.
You mention that YOU wouldn’t care, well, most of us painters do.
You say that credits aren’t hard to come by, not if you spend your time on the track. Most of my earnings come from my more popular paints.
You say that it’s not our intellectual property. You are right to an extent, but even original things which we create in-game still sort of belong to Turn 10.
When someone takes an algebra test, they are not creating a new formula, they are mathematically attempting to prove it. If you cheat by looking at their paper are you not copying them and stealing their work? Same goes for painting. While yes, copying the Bridgestone logo isn’t introducing something wholly new to the world, it is still creating something and doing something.
If you’ve even done ‘commercial’ graphics or photography, or even script/copy writing, you’ll know that if you copy a commercial “trademark”, no matter who you are, you are breaking the strict ‘copyright laws’ pertaining to intellectual property and commercial trademarks in general.
I have worked in the industry in the past and the laws are very clear on what you can and can not do with intellectual trademarks and licences etc.
If I’m asked to do some commercial pics for someone/company or individual, i ‘own’ ALL images that I take, irrespective of the fact they are of the companies products/buildings/property etc. I then give the person contracting me permission to use infividual images based on a set number of prints or ‘runs’ in any publication. If they want to say do a second run of something, then they must pay once again for the use of ‘my IP’… They can not copy them or use them I anyway whatsoever. Same applies to graphic arts in crating commercial trademarks/logos.
Even changing a colour in order to not have it be “exactly” the same, is still a breach of those laws.
However, that bring said, we should be given the right to lock our work, or not as the case may be, so we have the choice as to whether or not others can freely use the basic trademark copies etc, so that the end user can create something he/she would like to share.
Not ever artist is a control nut, and many simply want others to enjoy the game. Especially when many do not have the time, inclination or expertise to create manurfacters logos.
I’m NOT talking about freestyle artwork creations. Just manurfacturers logo that used to be readily available in FM1-3…
I’m also not saying anyone should be forced to unlock their work, what I’m saying is, that we all be given that choice, rather than it be a blanket default situation which makes sharing liveries with fellow gamers in leagues or comps etc.
It’d also be great if when we select a logo, that the name of that logo be shown in the gui when creating artwork on our cars. Many of the darker logos are almost impossible to read, and they used to be shown above the group heading when selected. Just a little thing, but it helps especially for those with sight issues.
If not allowing our work to be usurped for in-game profit by other users constitutes being a control nut then most of us artists do fit your description. I want others to enjoy the game and the logos I create, there is nothing stopping them from enjoying them by downloading them and using them on their cars. They shouldn’t however be allowed to share things that aren’t 100% their own creations, how this takes away from their ability to enjoy the game boggles my mind. Stop using strawman arguments here.
I mean no disrespect to you or anyone, I was simply pointing out a flaw in the iterations from FM4-6 in that they no longer supply proper manurfacturers logo or trademarks so that users can create their own artworks or liveries free of having them for ably locked.
I see your point with regards to others making profit from another’s work. I have no quarms about that at all. I understand that Turn10/MS have made it impossible for anyone to create a livery without using someone else’s factory/manurfacturers official logos.
Which now need to be created from scratch, or, use a logo someone else has created. If the powers to be included the logos that were commonly available n FM1-3, we could create even better designs, lock them, or not, and thus allow others to use the liveries or like before, sell the cars with liveries and mods attached, such as in FM1-3.
Do you think that would help elevate some of the issues we are seeing with regard to others profiting from user created content??