Agreed Mitch.
Think the soul of the community is still here, but man do I miss some of the features from FM4 - from you guys helping out randoms who had data wipes to private lobbies/comps etc, etc.
Cracking post mate.
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While this was a fantastic post overall, I’ve included the lines that speak most pertinently to the situation.
First of all, the “2 types of haters” thing (1st paragraph). That’s spot on. Some of these people are probably on the forums for everything from PCars to BF4, saying the same, entitled, things. We won’t talk about them any further, because they sit just a level above trolls, and that is that.
The second half–that which I’m a part of–is the one that’s the most interesting, because I feel that there are a choice few games that have these players, and those are games–or in Forza’s case, franchises–that have a fantastically passionate following because the games were just that–fantastic. So it’s the best games that get the people that have the truest beefs, because they KNOW what they like, and what they’re expecting based on a very deep knowledge that they’ve earned through years of playing the game. So, in a way, it’s almost unfair to T10 as they can be seen, essentially, as victims of the “tough at the top” idiom.
HOWEVER
As passionate and knowledgeable as the players are, they should not be MORE knowledgeable than the devs. No way. Those guys are paid the big bucks to turn out a product that will keep the fans–the longtime fans of the series–happy. They have access to all this great feedback from us–it’s a lot to sift through, I admit that but there are algorithms that make the job a million times easier–and it’s on them to use it. Oh, by all means, insert some things that will make the greater populace happy; they’re as necessary to Forza as the Cayenne is to keeping Porsche in the black, so they’re needed. I do not think for a minute, however, that they should be more important to T10 than the enthusiasts, the true fans that don’t mind grinding their way through the game in Civics and Polos because they know that even those econoboxes have something to offer.
When the Mods were announced as some great new element to racing in a big, EXCITING news post I knew right away: they were going to raise the ire of A LOT of players, and they have. When Fujimi got chopped–I don’t care for it, but many do–I KNEW it was going to cause problems, and it has. And as soon as the SF was proven, once again, to be relegated to the scrap heap, I KNEW it was going to be problematic. The worst part? I KNEW that there was nothing that FM6 could do–not rain, not Watkins Glen, not an eventual Porsche pack–that would make the longtime players forget what they lost.
Dan loves talking about how T10 is a bunch of gamers, they love playing all games, and they love borrowing elements from them. It’s like Walmart does; they’re the biggest out there, but they know that there’s a small guy, somewhere, doing something better than they are. And what does WM do? It finds that guy, and it copies his tech. So it’s great that T10 plays other games; not so great that the wrong elements from said games are making the transition.
Right, paragraph 2:
This is the truly scary part of Mitchy’s message.
What he’s talking about–looking forward to Fallout 4, and forgetting about Forza–is likely not some fluke. Yes, the games come from different devs. Yes, they’re different styles of game but most importantly: YES, they can be played by the same players, on the same console. Which–if I may go out on a limb–is exactly MS’ intention. More games being sold on the market means more interest in consoles, and more sales. If everyone was happy with the same game, on the same console, why get a new game? Why a new, next-gen console? All the best games I’ve played–my all-time faves–I could go back to, right now, and have a ball. FM4. HL. GTA:VC. Original CoD. RDR. NFS:PU. All of these are great, and all of them could be picked up right now and enjoyed by me.
And that, dear, readers, is simply not good for business. I know it sucks to hear it, but they want us to get bored, because they want us buying more. More DLC. More games. More consoles.
i like 6 a lot. its no forza 4 but its very very good and im playing it every day.
forza 5 was a joke. kinda like a beta release.
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I imagine people would be more modest with their criticism if there was any sign of Turn 10 actually reading them. As it is now everyone just rants straight onto the page because at the end of the day the odds of anything actually happening in response are minimal.
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I think it irks a lot of people when Dan Greenawalt is there at trade shows saying how much they rely on listening to their community and how it’s a community driven game, when that is clearly no longer true. It stinks of being disingenuous, and people really don’t like that.
@Carrick, we’d still be helping people now if they hadn’t removed gifting… Now I just play and help out with queries and tips here on the boards.
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The auction house was good for helping people too. If someone lost their game save I’d have them put a car up for auction and the I’d go buy it from them so they had money to build up their garage again. Felt good to help others within the community.
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It just seems downright bizarre, that’s what it is. So many design decisions just don’t make any sense.
Like Mitchy’s point about the mod cards - what are they even for? Making the races weird for extra credits? But it’s got simulation phsyics…
No way to set up your own race with a grid of specific opponent cars…but it’s got almost 500 cars across such a broad spectrum of car types…
Endurance races, but you can’t pick your car or tune it. And the pit stops aren’t animated.
Drivatars that learn to drive the way other players do, then put people at grid position 12 in a 3 lap race, so that the drivatars learn to be reckless lunatics. If you put a professional race car driver at position 12 and told him he has 3 laps to get to position 3 or better or else he would call his union rep for life endangerment.
Remove the storefront and auction house and then talk up the “community features”.
It beggars belief.
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Forza 3 wasn’t THAT bad guys LOL
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…and neither is 6.
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Problem is where can opinions be raised and discussed. There is a point to discussing a games downfalls - sure in some cases beauty or ugliness are in the eyes of the beholder.
Also I know some comments are not here to promote healthy discussion but on the other side of the coin it is my view that posts and threads on here on many topics are shot down before any chance to discuss.
Is it to avoid what is predicted to come after ? Maybe.
But there are plenty of things in this game and previous games, both good and bad that should be raised and discussed in my opinion.
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Gang, all most of the repliers are doing, is likely ensuring this thread is locked by getting it off topic.
Very little has been addressing the OPs statement/question
Nearly all of the replies have been a way for a thread to be turned into a ‘We want this feature’ / ‘We miss this feature’ / ‘We want this to be more like FMx’ complaint thread.
There are a countless number of them now in the forum.
I am not saying players and fans don’t have some interesting points or that there are not some valid reasoning behind the emotion, but there are built in avenues to express it, avenue’s Brian Ekberg stated are looked at, spread sheets are made from the posts weekly and discussed. That is what the wish list threads are for. This run-away thread just is that.
Again, not saying I disagree with some of your replies, but I have made posts in the proper place, and suggest everyone do the same if you feel that strongly about it, those are the threads that are read and have any chance of being reviewed. I doubt T10 staff has bandwidth to look at every single thread, especially all those off topic, to track down what every person wants or is complaining about.
To the OP, I wish I had a answer to give you, other then human nature, there are a lot of positive things said here, I still believe FM.net is the best gaming community out there and a lot of folks do as well, even if its hard to find their posts.
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He wanted to know why the hate, we answered with the reasons for the hate. That’s entirely on topic. People complain because of specific things, that we’ve listed. That is on topic and relevant information as far as i can see. The reasons for the “hate” need to be laid out to explain why the “hate”. We can’t just say, it’s because reasons we’re not allowed to sat in case we get thread locked. lol
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While I agree with you, to me there are alot of these issues, things that “belong” on wishlist threads that get no response or lead to any change when they ARE on the wishlists. I love forza, i love the physics of the game, i love the painting and the tuning. Where my hatred, OP’s subject, is what alot of people have mentioned. With 5 and 6, there seems to be a major disconnect with what the community, “wishlist and other more specific threads” and Turn10 has decided to do. Somebody in an earlier post stated that its very much a product of the industry as a whole. I do agree, COD was amazing in the COD 4 days and has steadily gotten more arcade, and rediculous (quickscoping, shotguns, dumb stuff!). Forza seems to be moving in the same direction. That is what makes me, as a long time customer, every game, every DLC, and they just push out the same game. After 10 years, you’d think maybe some different front or rear spoilers, but nope. Cant change that, need to come up with mod cards to use. Its obvious to me theres a huge community still in Forza. Sadly Turn10 seems very disinterested in what we think or feel about their product. Maybe that is the root of the “hate” that’s seen on the forums. A giant community of people that aren’t listened to or at the very least feel ignored. These days $65 isnt easy to come by for alot of us, not to mention VIP, Car packs etc. Even if they hired or assigned somebody that HAS the info that many of us are asking about, if we felt our voices were being heard, most of the angst and hostility would subside. But then again, it IS the internet, and people can just be angry…about and at anyone or anything.
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I’ve been here since FM1, same old story.
People are exited for the release, then complain about it,“It’s the worst FM yet !”.
For me there is no worst or best FM game. I think they’re all good and enjoyed all of them.
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That’s the PERFECT customer a lazy gaming studio needs. Congratulations!
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Wow… Sorry to have an opinion…
If they’re lazy and I can still enjoy the game, what is the problem ?
You could probably say my standards are not high enough and I shouldn’t settle for mediocrity…
Forza Motorsport is the only game I buy on release, because it’s one of the only game I am sure to have over 100 hours of gameplay…
I don’t say they couldn’t be better, I’m just saying I enjoyed all of them, and I’m not trying to find which one is the worst.
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Having spent the last two posts on the board bringing up something I missed from other games that didn’t cross over into Forza 6(individual races on event list) I will point out that the base game is good. Really good. A lot of people I see on here want to see some of these old features back so a good game can be truly brilliant.
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BMWBRAZIL - there’s no need to quote people who don’t happen to agree with you and make disparaging comments. That’s not constructive in any way.
Also posting insulting comments about the game studio whose forums you happen to be using isn’t such a hot idea.
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I have an idea.
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I didn’t want people to agree with me in first place. This is a discussion forum and the thread is about the hate (or in my case frustation for all the things that could make the game better).
And I didn’t offended (or at least I didn’t mean to) the guy calling him perfect customer.
But yes, calling the studio lazy can be offensive. I should have said something else, because I agree, it’s for sure not constructive. But it’s the frustration man. Many people here are trying to draw the attention of Turn10.
Calling them lazy because of all copy and paste they did in Forza 6 could help in a future meeting in the Turn10 office. Maybe they should look into it and start to make things better.
I think people can open threads to express they are very satisfied with the product as well as people have the right to criticize it.
It would not be very useful if everyone say the game is great.