OMG....Really? Forza Motosports Series, What Happened?

[BaDeeDoDa]

Sorry, I’m sure there has been a ton of these posts, but I just have to add my own. Let me start by saying that I’ve been enjoying the Forza series since Forza Horizon 1, which was my first exposure. Since then, I’ve purchased many of the Forza releases. Both Horizon and Motorsport. I’m currently at the star level in FH3, which I’ve played pretty much nightly since it was released. When FM7 was released, I purchased it right away, hoping that it would be a more serious version of FH3. I’ve now had some time to run a few FM7 races, and man…WTH? It’s like racing a soap opera. Everything in the game to me is over exaggerated. Mind you, I have set difficulty to the max (as I do in FH3), but come on.

First, I tried single player. and every drivatar in the game can take magically take corners at miraculous speeds, without even as much as a twitch. Every Drivatar car in single player has lightning acceleration out of the corners, while I’m milking the throttle, to keep the car from going spastic. To be honest, I wasn’t a big fan of the Drivatars in FH3 either, but at least you could beat them with a little common sense driving.

So, I’ve just given up on the single player portion of FM7. I really prefer multiplayer racing anyway. So last night, I took my first lap of multiplayer. I started in the newbie lobby with everyone in the Lambo. The idea was to not be aggressive, but to hang back, and get used to the experience of FM7 multiplayer. First couple of corners, and I’m asking myself why is the car screeching and trying to oversteer in every corner? Even at reasonable speeds, FM7 just seems to want to create racing drama. So, I slow down even more, and now it’s me in 10th of 12th position I think (hanging back). And what happens? I get booted halfway around the track by the 11th position car. Really? You’'re in 11th position. Where are you going? OK, so maybe he or she is getting used to the game like I am, no hard feelings. I find way back to the track, only to be greeted in my rear view mirror by the 11th position car ramming full speed into every tire wall, in an attempt to catch up and take me out again. Screw this…I’m going back to FH3. We have multiplayer hacks there as well, but at least for the most part, the game itself is not trying to create drama.

In a final attempt to find the good in FM7, I visited You Tube to see how the pros do it? Can you say [Mod Edit - Abbreviated profanity, profanity and profanity that is disguised but still alludes to the words are not permitted - D]? Just one video after another of racers being booted off the track, and others complaining about it. Let me out of here. WTH is my copy of Mario Cart? I know what to expect over there…

[Brisbaneroad]

@BaDeeDoDa

I started in the newbie lobby

Uh this? Set a car up for yourself, and keep lapping. You’re probably on cold chinese tyres.

[BaDeeDoDa]

Thanksfor the productive comment. There probably is some truth to the Newbie lobby thing. I really do want to like FM7. Remembering back, it did take me a while to get into FH3. Maybe FM7 just requires one to be more detail oriented, which is not a big part of FH3. I’ll do some tweaking before I give up. And see if I can find something other than Chinese tires

@Brisbaneroad

@BaDeeDoDa

I started in the newbie lobby

Uh this? Set a car up for yourself, and keep lapping. You’re probably on cold chinese tyres.

[Brisbaneroad]

@BaDeeDoDa

Thanksfor the productive comment. There probably is some truth to the Newbie lobby thing. I really do want to like FM7. Remembering back, it did take me a while to get into FH3. Maybe FM7 just requires one to be more detail oriented, which is not a big part of FH3. I’ll do some tweaking before I give up. And see if I can find something other than Chinese tires

@Brisbaneroad

@BaDeeDoDa

I started in the newbie lobby

Uh this? Set a car up for yourself, and keep lapping. You’re probably on cold chinese tyres.

I find sports tyres work really well in this game, much better than they used to. There are some real bogies when homologated though, such as street tyres on a 1000bhp Ultima. Heat just makes the damn thing worse…makes me wish I had wheel and pedals, controller offers nowhere near the intricacy of throttle control. Sorry that wasn’t meant to come across as antagonistic (it kinda does…), literally, to be competetive I’ve been doing enduros and I know I’m ready when 10 laps in a row are within a hundredth of each other.

[NightDriver7800]

“A more serious version of Horizon 3” lol

I was doing Forzathon challenges in Horizon 3 yesterday. You find that AI better than the one in Forza 7? That AI, complete with rubberbanding and tendency to crash you out of checkpoints? That AI, which makes all cross country events a torment to go through? All of these traits get even worse on Unbeatable. It’s widely known that Forza 7’s AI cheats on Unbeatable, but, amazingly, still not to the extent Horizon 3’s AI does.

Most of the fun in Horizon 3 is in fooling around doing stuff, at least when dumb traffic and strategically spawned Drivatars aren’t there to ruin your fun. When it comes to actual racing however, any Forza Motorsport game has Horizon 3 handily beat.

There are rammers in both games. It’s a trait that Turn 10 needs to eliminate from the franchise. It’s just that Horizon 3 is relatively empty online these days so you don’t get them very often. Furthermore, in addition to rammers, you must contend with drifters doing stunts to win the event, as what counts is exp points earned, not finishing position.

You’re welcome to watch ForzaRC on Wednesday to see how the actual pros do it.

[Brisbaneroad]

I’ve not found it bad at all. I’d say 90% of the time I’m in a gripping battle…whoich is fine by me even if it’s for 20th place lol. I don’t really give a damn about winning, I just wanna clean battle with at least one other driver.

[Ti_Hsien]

If max difficulty AI is too difficult for you, then turn it down. It’s a bit more unforgiving than FH3 AI. I’ve seen people gripe about how the AI takes turns in both games, but in my experience the turns are usually where I gain ground on the hardest difficulty - it’s the straights where they potentially become rockets.

It also sounds like you probably ought to turn on traction control and/or turn steering from simulation to normal. Or else choose cars that you can handle.

[Brisbaneroad]

@Ti_Hsien

If max difficulty AI is too difficult for you, then turn it down. It’s a bit more unforgiving than FH3 AI. I’ve seen people gripe about how the AI takes turns in both games, but in my experience the turns are usually where I gain ground on the hardest difficulty - it’s the straights where they potentially become rockets.

It also sounds like you probably ought to turn on traction control and/or turn steering from simulation to normal. Or else choose cars that you can handle.

TCS is terrible in this game. The TCS kicks in and completely kills your drive. Got understeer? Need a little throttle to neutralize it? TCS says NO! Would be so much more worth your while setting up your diff to allow a little slip and control the throttle as best you can, also concentrate on bringing the car’s weight down rather than adding power.

[Ti_Hsien]

@Brisbaneroad

TCS is terrible in this game. The TCS kicks in and completely kills your drive. Got understeer? Need a little throttle to neutralize it? TCS says NO! Would be so much more worth your while setting up your diff to allow a little slip and control the throttle as best you can, also concentrate on bringing the car’s weight down rather than adding power.

This is, in fact, the first game in the series where I can actually feel the TCS kicking in. I’m lazy about my settings, so in other games I just turn it on and forget about it so it’s there the handful of times I need it, but in this one I mostly keep it off until I find myself needing it. The fact that this game allows me to change it mid race has come in handy.

Tuning in general, if available, can really help with handling issues, too. And if throttle control is the issue, the OP might need to adjust the deadzones in options.

[Brisbaneroad]

@Ti_Hsien

@Brisbaneroad

TCS is terrible in this game. The TCS kicks in and completely kills your drive. Got understeer? Need a little throttle to neutralize it? TCS says NO! Would be so much more worth your while setting up your diff to allow a little slip and control the throttle as best you can, also concentrate on bringing the car’s weight down rather than adding power.

This is, in fact, the first game in the series where I can actually feel the TCS kicking in. I’m lazy about my settings, so in other games I just turn it on and forget about it so it’s there the handful of times I need it, but in this one I mostly keep it off until I find myself needing it. The fact that this game allows me to change it mid race has come in handy.

Tuning in general, if available, can really help with handling issues, too. And if throttle control is the issue, the OP might need to adjust the deadzones in options.

I have my controller adjusted through a great deal of trial and error. It still has nowhere near the travel a throttle pedal has of course, but as I say I tune my cars to get around the issue as much as possible. Some cars are just wildly unruly though, like that Ultima on its ditch-finding street tyres. Man, it took some serious concentration to win that series, many attempts, lots of swearing and a whole lotta black lines.

[EpicEvan777]

@Brisbaneroad

@Ti_Hsien

If max difficulty AI is too difficult for you, then turn it down. It’s a bit more unforgiving than FH3 AI. I’ve seen people gripe about how the AI takes turns in both games, but in my experience the turns are usually where I gain ground on the hardest difficulty - it’s the straights where they potentially become rockets.

It also sounds like you probably ought to turn on traction control and/or turn steering from simulation to normal. Or else choose cars that you can handle.

TCS is terrible in this game. The TCS kicks in and completely kills your drive. Got understeer? Need a little throttle to neutralize it? TCS says NO! Would be so much more worth your while setting up your diff to allow a little slip and control the throttle as best you can, also concentrate on bringing the car’s weight down rather than adding power.

Traction control is OP as hell in higher classes.

[I_Fluvio_I]

@EpicEvan777

@Brisbaneroad

@Ti_Hsien

If max difficulty AI is too difficult for you, then turn it down. It’s a bit more unforgiving than FH3 AI. I’ve seen people gripe about how the AI takes turns in both games, but in my experience the turns are usually where I gain ground on the hardest difficulty - it’s the straights where they potentially become rockets.

It also sounds like you probably ought to turn on traction control and/or turn steering from simulation to normal. Or else choose cars that you can handle.

TCS is terrible in this game. The TCS kicks in and completely kills your drive. Got understeer? Need a little throttle to neutralize it? TCS says NO! Would be so much more worth your while setting up your diff to allow a little slip and control the throttle as best you can, also concentrate on bringing the car’s weight down rather than adding power.

Traction control is OP as hell in higher classes.

Yeah some R class cars and above are just absurdly faster with TCS it’s insane. The guys who can get top leaderboard scores in the RS17 with hardcore assists are the true Gods of this game IMO.

[NightDriver7800]

@Ti_Hsien

If max difficulty AI is too difficult for you, then turn it down. It’s a bit more unforgiving than FH3 AI. I’ve seen people gripe about how the AI takes turns in both games, but in my experience the turns are usually where I gain ground on the hardest difficulty - it’s the straights where they potentially become rockets.

It also sounds like you probably ought to turn on traction control and/or turn steering from simulation to normal. Or else choose cars that you can handle.

Yeah the AI has boosted horsepower on higher difficulties, but they don’t take corners very well.

In Horizon 3, even with rubberbanding, they have a really hard time getting around chicanes.

[DunkelheitVZ]

@Ti_Hsien

If max difficulty AI is too difficult for you, then turn it down. It’s a bit more unforgiving than FH3 AI. I’ve seen people gripe about how the AI takes turns in both games, but in my experience the turns are usually where I gain ground on the hardest difficulty - it’s the straights where they potentially become rockets.

It also sounds like you probably ought to turn on traction control and/or turn steering from simulation to normal. Or else choose cars that you can handle.

This - AI is slow in corners, if you feel different, you probably have the wrong car.

[LucasMirO]

“I was hoping for a more serious version of FH3”

And then people wonder why the Motorsport series is dying…

[NightDriver7800]

A little off-topic but it’s not that it’s dying, it’s that the public’s preference has largely shifted towards arcade rather than sanctioned racing.

Why the outcry against homologation? Because people want as much freedom as possible. Homologation is the opposite. Where do you see homologation IRL? Sanctioned racing.

Turn 10 adds lots of vintage race cars in DLC, cars that other simulators are dying to have. The fanbase complains. Why? They don’t want sanctioned racing, they want street cars they can “trick out” and pit against other street cars. In other words, freedom.

Look around. Channels like Hoonigan, YouTube celebs who own exotic cars, stunt driving, etc., are the trend now. Motorsport as a whole is not as fashionable as it used to be. This is sad IMO, but it’s how it is. Where can you find this content, where can you better imitate this content? Forza Horizon. Not Forza Motorsport. I think Forza Motorsport’s biggest edge on Forza Horizon is still the Nordschleife, the rest is relevant to the aficionados but we shrink every day.

Forza Horizon will overtake Forza Motorsport. Forza Horizon 3 has superseded Need for Speed Underground 2 in the minds of people. I think Turn 10 should take this as a sign it’s futile to bring the branches closer together. Make Motorsport the highly polished, less accessible game and Horizon the casual, relaxing one. Forza Motorsport only needs to defeat its competitors, it does not need to be among the highest-selling titles on the Xbox One.

Fun fact: I vastly prefer Forza Motorsport’s physics, unless we’re talking about drifting, then Forza Horizon is way more fun.

[Alan_J_T]

@NightDriver7800

Forza Horizon will overtake Forza Motorsport.

Horizon 3 has all ready over taken Forza MotorSport in sales, Horizon 3 all by its self has sold almost more than the Entire MotorSport series take in Horizon 1, 2 and 3 and the future release of Horizon 4 and Horizon sales will blow Motorsport out of the water.

As I see it Horizon is now the game of choice for most Players who enjoy Racing style games while Motorsport has taken a back seat to Horizon as a filler game between Horizon Series releases.

Horizon is where the money is being made with almost 5,000,000 copies of Horizon 3 sold, add in the sales from 1 and 2 as well, and the pictuer becomes clear just what game is the actual FlagShip game now, Hint it is no longer Forza MotorSport.
Forza Motorsport may actuall now be a black hole for money costing more to make than it returns in sales. I know where I would be putting my resources and best staff if I was running Turn 10 and it is not the MotorSport series.

You put your best talent and resources into the product that will give you the best return Horizon seemes to be out selling the MotorSport series by whopping 4.5 to 1 ratio.

[GamerBlades]

@NightDriver7800

Fun fact: I vastly prefer Forza Motorsport’s physics, unless we’re talking about drifting, then Forza Horizon is way more fun.

Funny thing i feel the other way arround. Drfiting in horizon, way to easy.(i get bored of it really quick) Drifting in motorsport feels just right With a Controller imo.
To each their own

[I_Fluvio_I]

@BaDeeDoDa

Sorry, I’m sure there has been a ton of these posts, but I just have to add my own. Let me start by saying that I’ve been enjoying the Forza series since Forza Horizon 1, which was my first exposure. Since then, I’ve purchased many of the Forza releases. Both Horizon and Motorsport. I’m currently at the star level in FH3, which I’ve played pretty much nightly since it was released. When FM7 was released, I purchased it right away, hoping that it would be a more serious version of FH3. I’ve now had some time to run a few FM7 races, and man…WTH? It’s like racing a soap opera. Everything in the game to me is over exaggerated. Mind you, I have set difficulty to the max (as I do in FH3), but come on.

First, I tried single player. and every drivatar in the game can take magically take corners at miraculous speeds, without even as much as a twitch. Every Drivatar car in single player has lightning acceleration out of the corners, while I’m milking the throttle, to keep the car from going spastic. To be honest, I wasn’t a big fan of the Drivatars in FH3 either, but at least you could beat them with a little common sense driving.

So, I’ve just given up on the single player portion of FM7. I really prefer multiplayer racing anyway. So last night, I took my first lap of multiplayer. I started in the newbie lobby with everyone in the Lambo. The idea was to not be aggressive, but to hang back, and get used to the experience of FM7 multiplayer. First couple of corners, and I’m asking myself why is the car screeching and trying to oversteer in every corner? Even at reasonable speeds, FM7 just seems to want to create racing drama. So, I slow down even more, and now it’s me in 10th of 12th position I think (hanging back). And what happens? I get booted halfway around the track by the 11th position car. Really? You’'re in 11th position. Where are you going? OK, so maybe he or she is getting used to the game like I am, no hard feelings. I find way back to the track, only to be greeted in my rear view mirror by the 11th position car ramming full speed into every tire wall, in an attempt to catch up and take me out again. Screw this…I’m going back to FH3. We have multiplayer hacks there as well, but at least for the most part, the game itself is not trying to create drama.

In a final attempt to find the good in FM7, I visited You Tube to see how the pros do it? Can you say [Mod Edit - Abbreviated profanity, profanity and profanity that is disguised but still alludes to the words are not permitted - D]? Just one video after another of racers being booted off the track, and others complaining about it. Let me out of here. WTH is my copy of Mario Cart? I know what to expect over there…

So let me get this straight. You put the game on the hardest difficulty. Found it far too difficult, and instead of solving the problem by reducing the difficulty, you decide to blame it on poor game design? Instead of accepting that you aren’t as fast as you thought you were. The AI is far from perfect, but your criticism is aimed at the wrong thing/person here.

Also, your definition of “Racing drama” is what everyone else calls “unable to throttle control”. From what I recall, unless you’re running TCS, FM7’s GT cars aren’t usually the friendliest cars that allow people to just run the stock setup and slap throttle into it as if it takes no control whatsoever. Sure if you do it right and have enough experience you can, but not as a new player and it usually requires a bit of practice and learning. Both of which you seem to have not done.

Now getting booted off the track. I absolutely understand, your first fair point has been made. T10 really do need to solve this problem. But everything else you said is purely down to you and your own driving ability…

[Brisbaneroad]

@l Foamy l

Also, your definition of “Racing drama” is what everyone else calls “unable to throttle control”. From what I recall, unless you’re running TCS, FM7’s GT cars aren’t usually the friendliest cars that allow people to just run the stock setup and slap throttle into it as if it takes no control whatsoever.

Uh, you do know there is a couple of Gallardos in this category, right?