Forza Motorsport 5 Reimagined: Rebuilding for Gamers and Car Lovers

Please let me state upfront that the following opinions, suggestions, and criticisms are my own. I don’t pretend to speak for anyone other than myself. Your experiences are unique and no less valid than mine.

I’m a longtime Xbox gamer, and at this point it’s probably fair to say I’m a “fanboy.” If we understand such a thing to mean I consume and enjoy all things Xbox related. As such I’ve been onboard with Forza Motorsport as a big fan since day one. Which is why I’ve found myself surprisingly underwhelmed, disappointed even, by the most recent release.

Its not due to a lack of “numbers,” ie not enough cars or tracks (although, I really do miss Nurburgring), or even the heavy pay-to-play monetization of player progress. As I’ve played Forza Motorsport 5 there’s been a feeling of “where’s the soul?” If such a thing could be said to have existed in the prior games. Instead of just sending in an email saying “Make the next game better, or else!” I wanted to dive into what I would have done with the Forza Motorsport franchise to build it for the new generation. So here we go…

First, what are the challenges that Forza Motorsport is facing in its fifth iteration? Well, its not the nuts and bolts of cars on pavement. The physics model is now unparalleled, the cars have never looked so good in a console game, and while overly aggressive the new AI-Drivatar tech does make other racers feel more alive than ever before. So where did it go wrong?

    1. Forza Motorsport 5 feels like a game that can’t decide if it wants to be a driving simulator or a racing simulator, and thus attempts to hit both with equal if uninspired gusto. You don’t get the pre-race fanfare of a proper racing game experience, and there’s no open roads to take your car out on to experience the joy of driving. Even the two longest tracks that let you get something of an open road feel, Nurburgring and Jujimi Kaido, failed to ship in the box.
    1. The open ended nature of the game (pick the car you like, upgrade it, and race in these multiple series) degrades a sense of progress by not giving players a clear path to traverse. There is now so much history, and so many types of vehicles to drive, that the onboarding process feels more scattershot than it ever has before. Coming from the clear progression set by Forza Horizon the sense of progression in FM5 feels lackluster.
    1. The player’s time is not respected by the user interface: you can’t quit a series until you load into the next race, post race tally screens take too long to appear, getting from one part of the game to another requires far too many clicks.
    1. After five Forza Motorsport games the series still lacks a sense of unifying elements. There’s no signature music, user interface element, or brand ambassador (ala Cortana) that tie the games together. Even the logo changes from game to game.

Now at this point it may sound like I wanted Turn 10 to make Forza Horizon 2 with real world tracks, and that’s not totally off from some of my thoughts. However, while I think Forza Horizon set a high bar for items 3 and 4 above, there’s places Forza Motosport can go that Horizon will never touch. So with that in mind, here’s my take on how I would have shaped Forza Motorsport 5 to meet the above challenges…

    1. Rebuild the career mode around a single player rags-to-riches racing star narrative that centers on the player starting on a small local track racing in a low powered (D-class) car. The game begins with a local Seattle sponsor (Microsoft’s XBOX division) taking you out behind a rundown garage to pick from one of five free starter cars and putting the player into an entry level racing series.

Track loading screens now feature real world drivers (building the Forza brand as a premier racing experience on consoles) giving tips about how to take that track’s tricky turns or history about the track. Forza has nailed making car lovers into gamers and gamers into car lovers, but now its time for some racing history and track lore. Forza Motorsport players should love the locations they’re taking their cars.

Once you’re onsite there is an option to do a couple of warm up laps or a qualifying run to get a better starting spot. As you run warm up laps the game feeds you tips over an in car radio ie “you’re running hot on this lap, watch your tires” or “that last turn was rough, try dropping into 3rd gear.” Said audio is pre-recorded of course, but like Madden the game attempts to line up feedback based on your driving.

Each series (all class based) includes branches for the player to try their hand at one-off non-racing events such as bowling pins, drag racing, chase, hot laps, ect. Like Forza Horizon some of these side events will supply the player with a car to drive, thus allowing for a one-off mini-series like “Classic Muscle Cars” without requiring the player to go out and purchase and tune a car they might only use one. This also allows for specifically tuned cars so that instead of an unbalanced A-class auto-upgraded classic muscle car the player gets a tuned car capable of handling the event. The final knock on effect is that challenge leaderboards with friends now have everyone driving the same car, leveling the playing field for some of the leaderboards which opens up more competition between players of varying skills.

As the player completes a class series they are presented with a cutscene and a choice of a free car from a selection (5-6) specially pre-tuned for the next class level. If the player wishes to keep their current car, or bring another lower class car along for the ride the game will walk the player though the upgrade process. The auto-upgrade option will still be there, but now a player can specify if they want the car tuned for handling/speed/power/ect.

The appearance of the player’s garage improves with each class (going from dusty barn to futuristic Tony Stark level appearance at the highest level).

If a player doesn’t wish to partake in the guided class experience and wishes to jump ahead, they can either go to the event challenge screen (similar to Forza Motorsport 4’s grid of events) or challenge for a class improvement mid series (this will work similar to the licensing system of Grand Turismo). Conversely if a player wishes to do nothing but a single event, such as Chase, the game UI and flow will allow for that.

To give the single player a sense of place the AI drivers will have tuned personalities on track, cars with design/colors that match, and even engage in banter with the player after each race. The goal is to create an off track experience for the player that imitates something like the movie RUSH where the player will come to respect even the most hated AI driver. The AI drivers will come to be sponsored by different companies, allowing for easy visual identification of their cars on track, and a sense of progression as cars go from hobby kits to full fledged F1 cars covered in logos.

Your friend’s Drivitars will only appear in non-race events as the goal of the single player career is to make the player feel like the champion, not a piece of meat being bashed around by their friends and random Xbox Live profiles. In single player races the AI drivers shouldn’t attempt to run a player off the road as this creates a bad racing experience. However, side events such as chase or demolition derby style hotlaps should have rough-and-tumble AI, and this is the perfect place for Drivitars.

    1. The user interface needs to be rebuilt with a sense of flow that respects the player’s time. It should be easy to go anywhere with just two clicks. The user interface is also where Forza Motorsport can build a sense of brand awareness by adding texture, color, and visual elements that will carry from game to game. The current hierarchy heavy interface will be replaced by a floating menu that works more like a modern web page, with context sensitive reshuffling of elements, and color/texture that allows for easy visual navigation.

In-race the heads up display needs to include the traditional elements as well as a new turn indicator that appears on the track (similar to the guideline) that tells the player both how far away the next turn is, and what turn number it is. This will tie into the real-world driver narration that fills the track loading screen. The idea here is to teach the player how to tackle each track, rather than dumping them on a track.

Finally, in the interest of saving the player time both race and non-race events will happen on the same track. Ie, you will load into a track and both the visual elements and UI will reflect a current festival such as “Hot Hatches Days.” This allows the player to quickly switch between a career race, then take a breather with a hot lap, and finally blow off steam by doing a bowling pin event all while still loaded on the same track. The player gets more exposure to a track, and doesn’t have to sit through several minutes of loading screens just to do a single event on a track.

    1. The player’s car is not restored to perfect working order by magic after each race/event. Instead wear and tear will carry over. Major areo impacting dents and breaks will be fixed (at a very small cost to the player, creating an in-game money sink to prevent players from building huge bankrolls just as the Forza series has always done) but scratches and dings will live on unless more expensive repairs are done.

This allows the player to build a connection to their car and remember where they were when say the left front fender got a huge scratch. Repainting a car will cover up deep scratches, but thanks to the advanced materials shaders the game will allow the player to see the remains of the scratch under the layer of paint.

Cars should be valuable to players not because they spent dozens of hours earning enough credits to buy them, or shelling out a bunch of real world $money to purchase it… but because the player has lived in, driven, destroyed, and rebuilt it. Eric Banna’s documentary movie “Love The Beast” captures the vibe that Forza Motorsport should be aiming for in future games.

The concept of rarity in a digital space is very hard, if not conceptually disingenuous, and while noble it feels like efforts to make exotic cars hard to earn/buy has gotten out of hand. Player engagement though grinding away at earning credits belongs in the same place RPGs put grinding, in the past.

So, these are my thoughts. I’m curious how many of them you agree with, and if you disagree I’d love to know where you think I’ve gone wrong. If you’ve read this far, thank you.

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I have nothing to argue with here, surprisingly. Only one point I have. With the high standard Turn 10 set for tracks and cars, I understand the lack of Fujimi and the Nordschleife. Fujimi: I respect the decision to at least postpone it because they believed it wasn’t next-gen material. The Nordschleife: I believe I can speak for everyone when I say, it was expected that it wasn’t included. I love it, I miss it. At the same time, it was only a 7.5/10.

Great read, homie. Good points, I agree with much of what you write, especially the concept of carryover damage. This would foster a sense of car ownership and responsibility, and, if implemented in multiplayer, could even cut down on wrecking: ppl may be less likely to ram each other if they know the car isn’t gonna repair itself postrace.

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Very well summed, I agree with much of what you write.

although i disagree with your view of forza 5 as its my favorite so far, thats a great write up and good ideas for future games.

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While I agree with a lot of what you say, it seems like you want Gran Turismo ported to the Xbox One.

As a driver/racer, I want to drive/race. I agree with your comments about respecting the player’s time. I would add money to that mix as well.

How does it help me as a player to take the time to repair the car after each race? And spend the credits I just earned to pay for the repairs?

I guess the only way we’ll ever get to buy new cars is by using tokens; but that’s a whole 'nother issue.

Get yourself a PS4 and good luck with your Gran Turismo career. FM5 ain’t perfect but it’s not terrible.

I like most of the points you make except one: the “Rags to Riches” career mode. I like the idea of returning the build up of classes, however the part that makes me pick Forza over other racers is that they don’t attempt a “Story” so to speak. For me, the story is the cars themselves, I can fell immersed in the pure ownership of it, driving it, painting it, tuning it, etc. When you add a story element a-la Horizon, it kills all immersion for me instantly. Then it goes from “look at this car I got and love” to “oh yeah, I beat so-and-so at a generic NFS race so my ‘underdog rookie’ avatar can drive it.” I know that’s only my view of it, but I just dislike the idea of playing as a character playing as a driver if that makes sense. Having to earn sponsors and do specific things in racing games makes it feel more like a chore than an experience, especially when Forza has always used the fantastic Affinity system, giving you rewards no matter what brand/car you use. I guess in short I’d think adding some of your suggested featured, but sticking with the old “Where dreams are Driven” motto rather than “Where dreams are unlocked after completing these specific racing events in a pre-tuned car for this requirement in the story”
Otherwise excellent read.

I agree, a story wouldn’t work terribly well. I envision just the loosest of introductions, ie “Welcome to Forza Motorsport Worldwide Events. Your sponsor, Xbox, can seat you in one of these five starter cars” and then on you go. The “story” as such would be delivered through visuals such as a garage that improved/upgraded as you got into higher level class races and AI drivers that taunted you post race with different sayings. As little as Horizon had for story, I’m thinking less then that.

There would still be a story/guided free experience if you wanted to just jump into an event or race without going through the guided experience. Sort of like the grid of races from FM4.

I absolutely hated Grand Turismo’s licensing system, and would never introduce something like that to Forza. There should always be the option to skip a class, event, or race if you’re not having fun.

Great post, I agree with most if not everything you said.

I thought about the same things ever since the game came out, especially the career mode which I abandonned almost immediately…sometimes I feel like they should call it Forza Automobili, because there is no motorsport in it. Like TheFishE77 said, I don"t care for a story either, but I would love proper driver evolution through the career.

I’ll leave it at that to avoid turning this into a wishlist, we know the fate those threads face.

Good points…Give the man a job haha

I agree about Forza does not seem to know what kind of game it is, Driving Simulator or Racing Simulator…It does seem to want to do both but doesnt seem to do either enough. We have tons and tons of regularly cars with no roads to race them on and we have very little race cars but alot of race tracks. Racing the GT cars online it does the Racing Simulator VERY WELL indeed and i honestly think Forza would benefit in going more towards a race sim than driving sim.

Strangely, I’ve always enjoyed grinding, so the career/narrative aspects were a little lost on me, but you totally nailed it with the UI comments. No matter how much I enjoy some aspects of the game, I just want to hurl my controller at the screen sometimes with the clunkiness of the menu system, and the protracted post-race fol de rol … well, no need to go on. It’s as though they had the physics engine and the tracks, and the rest was just thrown together in a rush. Oh, hang on …

I have to say I am not agree with your vision of Forza 5/6 next game idea there’s no need of open road in Forza 5/6, Horizon is there for that and you know what I liked this game Horizon its not Forza Motorsports. I have to say tought that your idea of a more story telled carrer could bee awsome like the one we see in Grid 1 (did not play Grid 2)…For my point of view (me and only me) I am agree with you the game looked awsome the cars drives awsomelly like noting we’d see at this time tracks looks freaking great (almost like in the real life) … Cars: ok we miss some racing cars GT3, WTCC, DTM, even nascar (even if I dont liked them),GT2 etc racing cars … but the one we got there are awsome and the open wheel what a great ad on … so glade to see them finaly in forza. I did not pay the carrer mode simply cause its borring I prefer to go online and get my credit there or to do some RIVALS. But as a online player that do organised online championship and also organised some. There’s some point that I can’t bealived there gone there’s some points: 1-we cannot do qualifation anymore (seriouly why ??? T10 get this option rip off) 2-capability to organised race that end in fonction off time (like the 12h of Sebring, 24h of le Mans etc … we again have this option in Forza 4) 3-Why can’t we build team (like we can do in Forza 4 yes yes AGAIN) 4-The possibility to share setup, livery, yes yes yes LIKE WE HAVE IN FORZA 4… seriously Ithink I know why Forza 5 miss that soul you talked about …Forza 4 was the best COMMUNITY game EVER from All kind of game it have nothing closed maybe some MMORPG came close… but in a racing mode we’d never see something like that… I liked to be a little bird to assist at the game crating session to see were it all gone wrong and they take the desision to not put theme back in the game…and Finally its a racing game and the number of track is simply not anought … Its a racing game … so put a truck load of tracks please … and apparently you are not capable (Turn 10) of creating race tracks that don’t exist … (Maple Valley is a large fast paced track with long fast corners… Swiss Alpls large (as large as a US 8 lines highway) fast paced track with long fast corners …I hade great hope for Prague to be finally a great nice Urban track with tight corner, Esses there not even a 2nd gear hair pin esses ok you tighten the track at some point but there is till 8 lines US Hightway stuff ???)

Soooo Tracksssssssssssss please in Forza 6 dont do the same mistake don’t forget this points its sad to say but Forza its not a casual gamer game you have your hard core fan don’t forget Us

I can appreciate the thought that went into your post.

I hope that eventually Forza and Horizon will share framework and can share assets, and can then use both games to get the best of both worlds, prioritize for each type of racing gamer.
It would be groundbreaking for the franchise and racing games in general, if you could take vehicles between games, one being open world race culture, the other being hardcore sim.

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I thought was a terrific post and expression of thoughts and ideas by the creator of the thread. However I disagree, I am loving Forza 5 the way it is… (except for the “drivatars” which really cant drive no matter how you set them. (hopefully this will get tweaked and get better as time goes on)

I try to stay clean on laps and even if doing so still get kicked around by the drivatars so much it is frustrating. have to keep the difficulty of them to above average just to recover from getting wiped out all the first lap to have a chance of getting a decent place by race end.

With that being said I think Forza 5 is just fine the way it is now. looking forward to new add ons (tracks and cars) as they come along and any tweaks they have for the game. Hey it’s been out for what 5 mths now? and is this awesome. give it some time it surely will get better and better as we go along.

Thinkin the open road stuff will come along if and when someone decides to push forward with Horizon 2 for Xbone. but that will just have to wait as I see nothing upcoming for it except a FB page that really hasn’t been updated much at all in a long time. at this point doubtful we will see Horizon 2 for quite awhile yet.

I never was much a fan of GT series either. it seems almost like some want Forza to be more like that? think may lose more fanbase if it went in that direction. No?

It’d be great to link Horizon and FM. I’d love the chance to spend a few minutes driving cross-country, track-to-track in some cut-scene fashion.

Load times and post-race summary times I’ve always figured are there due to XB1 processing time. They probably have to figure some lowest-common-denominator assuming background processes (message/status monitoring, DVR, etc) The XB1 is not a single-tasking system, nor is it just a gaming console, so we don’t get all its firepower all the time.

double post oops

you think horizon is better? ohh boy. and turn ten dosn’t make horizon. the forza label was used on the non forza game to increase sales, it was marketing. the open ended nature means you can play it how ever you want within what the game offers. love aa certain track or car? play it as much as you want. dont like a certian track or car dont mess with it. its more sandbox and you seem to want rpg. you want a story in fm6? alot of what you want in fm1. adding real world drivers means you have to pay them, meaning less money for the programmers. nothing to tie fm together? there is already too much tying it together. you thought horizon was a turn ten product. horizon is made in the uk by playground games.

it sounds like you want a game made by ea sports. maybe test drive will be more to your likeing. the game you would love wont be forza. maybe send playground games an email telling them what you want in horizons 2. http://www.playground-games.com/

That would be a link to forza horizon… On FM.net. Sure playground are the developers, but lets be serious. Turn 10 did assist in the development. They worked together, if you’ve played horizon you should easily be able to see that. I could see a merge in the future (I believe it would be genius, however far in the future that may be). If you don’t believe track racers don’t enjoy the open road, you’ve clearly never driven a track inspired car along a mountain byway.

Essentially, Turn 10 gave Playground games the basics to their game, physics, engine, features, and said have fun with it.

I agree with most of what you said. One other thing that I think is needed (this is obviously going to require more tracks and cars). Instead of the “Rags to riches” thing, split Career up into 5-10 categories, dependent on the car and track list.

You have a racing series involving:

Australian Supercars (take the Ford or Holden as a blank canvas and paint your own design, or use one of the other many real life designs, or buy one off of the storefront). Race them on the tracks that actually pertain to them, Bathurst would be one).

F1 (same as the Australian Supercars, except with F1 vehicles. Only on F1 styled tracks).

ALMS racing which is split into two categories:
GT Class (GT1, 2, 3 cars like the Ferrari 458 Competizione, Corvette ZR1.R, etc. Again, only tracks pointing towards ALMS style or GT style. All races would be mixed with Prototype cars because that’s how ALMS is done in real life).
Prototypes (The Peugeot 908, etc. Only on ALMS tracks. Would basically be a similar track list as the GT Cars Career, and would be on track with them.)
Both GT And Prototype Classes would have races and then a 12 hours of Sebring (split up into segments where you and your drivatar split off), and a 24 hours of Le Mans. This would obviously require night cycle. You can take breaks between 4 hour stints where your Drivatar races that next 4 hours and you can either watch, quit and do something else and return to it later with your Drivatar finishing it, or just skip it and move onto your next stint, until the race is over.

Manufacturer races (Races on any tracks with any cars that are production or concepts only, no race cars, just like Forza pretty much was in FM4, FM3, etc. You can upgrade them to their required classes and this could be where the Rags to Riches essence is.)

And so on.

As I said before, this would require a few things like Day/Night cycles, weather would be cool to have for it and that would be randomly set, and more tracks and cars might be needed. But this could be done for Forza 6 if they do end up bringing in the cycles. It would be a much more valiant Career than the boring current one. I have no desire anymore to work on it, and am approximately 40% completed with it.