it was career yak. you had to beat a certain car/class to open that class to buy. if you didn’t beat it yu couldn’t buy the cars for that class.
trust me it took me for ever to win with that old ferrari on blue mountains, i cant drift and had to learn to win that race. i think you had to beat a vette driven by m rossi if i remember right. you couldn’t unlock the ferrrari #12 until you beat it at level 50
The drivers in FM1 were nameless. They just had the name of the vehicle in the grid ordering and results. Are you sure this was FM1 you were describing?
yep. you didn’t have to beat blue mountains in that old ferrari ? i know its been years but i hope i’m not that old. it was the clockwise race. and i remember trying to buy another car to beat it with and couldn’t because it wasn’t unlocked. unless i had to drive an ill handeling vette and beat the ferrari. now you have me doubting myself. but i am still sure that old ferrari and blue mountains dont mix, i had to throw it sideways and hope it caught traction again just in time to make the corners. the left going up the hill and the right soon after. for me that was the hardest race of the entire game. and that was before assits, you just had to keep trying until you figgred it out and got it right.
it taught me i didn’t always really want what i thought i wanted. i always wanted to try that ferrari until i did in that game. always wanted to drive a veron and ariel atom until i did in forza. now i think if i’m actually going to have to drive it i would rather have something like a ford focus or ultima, something with great handeling rather than great speed. something i can keep on the track even pushing it.
Like others in this thread, I do agree to the fact that the in game economy is based about overall player progression, the career mode and game content. I mean, if you think about it, the career mode in FM5 was just literally a few races in different genre of cars, and you could choose which one to compete in first, unlike in FM2, where you had to unlock certain championships and cars to compete in those championships - progression. Not just, go buy a car, compete in car, get money, buy faster car. I mean, I still love my starter car in FM2 - A Pontiac Solstice, and I upgraded it to compete with more difficult opponents, not just throw it away and buy a new car. The game made you think (if you liked your starter car) ‘do I save up for a new car, or upgrade my current one’. Now, on FM5, money is not even a challenge to get, so we buy all the cars and get bored.
For instance, on FM5 you got a choice of three cars… I think, A RS3, M1 & A RX8… I mean, I don’t particularly really like any of those cars and they’re hardly ‘starter’ cars, and three cars is a pretty disappointing variety, previous Forza titles put that to shame.
I guess, what I’m trying to say is, previous Forza titles made the progression and earning money feel satisfying, and made the really expensive cars, seem exclusive and rare. I mean, now, if you see someone driving a Bugatti or an old Ferrari, no one looks twice.
Now, ever since FM4, career and money progression started to lack, as T10 started throwing in game money at us, making it pointless to actually do career mode.
I don’t know hy they got rid of it, but I miss how in older Forza games you had to pay for repairing your car, it made me feel even more tension in races knowing if I screwed up it was going to reduce my wining’s. Plus you also had choice from cosmetic, exterior, or realistic damage settings, if I recall corectly. I wantt o say Forza Motorsport 2 was the last game these were in.
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Personally I think Forza should drop the economy altogether when we fire up the sim for the first time we should be able to drive whatever car/class we want and have access to whatever upgrades we want take a look at Project Cars for the example of no economy racing.
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That is a horrible concept for me. I like haveing to earn my cars. Just being given everything is so boring, but unfortunately alot of games are starting to take that approach. I like looking at something expensive then working hard to earn the $, CR or whatever the game uses to buy it.
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Oops, I didn’t see this post before I wrote my own. Didn’t mean to steal your thunder, but I 110% agree with you.
Times change, so do gamers. Many gamers today, either have jobs, or other such reasons that don’t give them the time to play as they used to. Turn10 knows this. And thus the economy has changed accordingly.
They go with what the numbers tell them. As do other game devs. In my mind, the best economy, would be no economy. Everything free.
Actually the best economy would be optional, but then some would use it to get better cars free. Or 2 save files one that has an economy and one where everythings free. Wighful thinking but still what if?
i like having to earn my cars. makes winning seem more like a real reward. but if someone else got cars free that wouldn’t bother me at all. they can play how they want and i would play how i want. once you own everything and the credits are just stacking up in the corner it wasn’t as rewarding for me. it would be like doing a crossword puzzle thats already filled in. but if people want to trace over the crossword answer rather than doing the puzzle thats up to them. they can have their fun their way and i’ll have mine my way.
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Too many games these days have very short single player campaigns that can be completed in one or two sittings. Forza isn’t one of those games and has never been one of those games. It should be challenging to progress but not prohibitively so and it should reward those that put in the time and effort.
Anyone looking to bypass normal game mechanics and accelerate their progress or receive reward without the same amount of time and effort should be afforded every opportunity to empty their real wallets to do so.
Charge $60 for a standard game and double that price to have the game immediately reward you with 1000gs upon first start and I bet we would all be shocked at how many of the latter sell over the former.
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Ascetic masochism is for life, not just for Xmas; Or so it seems in this thread. 
If Turn10 want UGC to be shared freely, then the virtual price for the virtual cars should be zero as well. Communalism FTW!!
But with the monetization of the Forza economy with tokens, I doubt this is going to happen any time soon.
Putting in the requisite hours of single player racing in order to gain the needed number of credits to ‘buy’ your virtual car has always been an unnecessary evil in Forza IMHO.
The fun could really start once you could tune, photograph or paint your car, then perhaps show/share/sell your creation to other like minded people in the community , and of course racing them in MP.
None of these activities could be called casual, as each discipline took time and effort to learn. I agree with Hieronymus on this point at least. Forza is not a casuals game .
Forza at its best didn’t seem like a single player game, because the community driven features took on a life of their own. Take those features away, and the single player Forza is a rather sterile, empty experience, (no matter how pretty and godly sounding) and its lack of racing options means that no matter what the credit rewards are, people get bored and stop playing.
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You had me at hello.
I think the whole credit economy isn’t going to work without storefronts where you sell your own paints and tunes and auction houses. I think forza rewards has gotten out of control as well. The game still needs to have some sort of leveling system which is why i think they should use the affinity system to unlock parts, so lets say your in any kind of A class car as you race you gain affinity and you unlock A class parts. As far as cars, maybe they should be free because a cars price had nothing to do with performance in this game. So they can use what’s already in place in forza 5s career with the whole early grand touring then middle grand touring then modern grand touring. You start with early, choose whatever cars are there, then when you beat that the next set of cars unlock and so on and so fourth. I think it’s a nice balance of feeling like your earning something without feeling like it’s a grind. You’ll be able to get the cars you want to race pretty quickly without feeling forced to do a hundred races to get that P1 you want to drive. I think they should keep the free play how it was in forza 4 where you can drive any car you want but you can’t modify or paint them, it would also be a good place to gain affinity for a certain class. I think this could be a viable system to use with one problem for turn 10 which would be the eradication of their tokens, so i doubt a change like this would ever happen lol.
I second most of the posting above.
Wouldn’t it be good to offer two types of gameplay, right from the start? Type “Achiever”, the traditional Forza way of earning your cars, looking at a long term experience and type “Casualist” (or whatever, really), which is for those who can’t afford to sink the hours in and just love to drive nice cars. I’m somewhere in between, so I can understand both sort of players. I love to earn my things, it just makes me feel good, but I also have the job/girlfriend/other games-and-hobbies-situation and can’t put the needed hours in (, which is why I’m still trying to complete FM5).
Of course, the whole thing would have to be water tight. No tricks or ways to get cars or parts from the free mode to the other, no cheating whatsoever.
Wouldn’t that benefit sales as well, as the more casual thrill seekers would hop on board too, now?
Quick rant- Every game forum I go to nowadays has people saying “gimme everything in your game from the time I turn it on.” The reason is always predictable too, it is because they want to use the Ferari and skip the Focus because it’s not as impressive. It comes off like they’er either just in it for gamerscore or they have ADD. Now I have to admit here it seem’s like yall aren’t like that, but I just had to vent seeing all this free cars from the start talk. Also, when did “this game does it so you need to too” become a legitamate argument? Not saying I don’t respect your wanting the cars to be free, just put up an actual intelectual reason why, which you did but it would’ve carried more weight with me without mentioning another game. Rant over, I feel better now.
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I’d first off like to say this: The reason that I personally want a “tougher” economy and a throwback to the older days (like FM1/GT4/GT3/etc) is because back then you actually developed attachments to your cars. Whether it was that little starter car that you weren’t a fan of, but you made it work. Maybe it was a starter car that you liked and you molded it from underdog to competitor. Or maybe it was even that first car that you saved up to buy that you REALLY wanted. I mean, this was back when being able to afford like an S2000, R33, or a Supra was actually an accomplishment since you were used to making $600 a race in your Corolla-that-could. Shrug Maybe I’m the only one who occasionally pops in Forza 1 or Gran Turismo 4 even though I have the most current iterations of both.
Now slightly more on topic: The issue I have with casual-izing games in this genre is that it’s already a niche genre. Period. This is a genre that is solely for the “hardcore” and every year we seem to be getting stiffed just to try and impress someone who won’t touch the game anyways. I bet every single one of us can name a friend who would consider a Project Gotham Racing game to be realistic. The type of person to pick up a sim racer, start up a race, fly off the track on the first corner, and then give up without giving the game a second thought. These are the type of people who only have fun with racing games if it has Kart, Burnout, or Blur in the title. Maybe they’ll play Midnight Club or Need For Speed. Even then, there’s other stuff they’d rather play. Mind you, I love arcade racers as well, but what I’m saying is that this genre is not for them and there’s no amount of casual-ing that will change that.
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While I agree with most of what you said, Mario Kart, Blur are still challenging games to play. Play it online and you’ll soon find out it’s no cake walk. I do agree with everything else you’ve said though. I hope FM6 will go more towards FM4 than FM5.
For me FM is 75% MP and 25% career in terms of the time I play over the games life. One thing that’s killed FM5 is the quality of driving by online players. I put a lot of this down to people not spending the time learning how to drive a range of cars starting in the lowest class and working up. Both the career and therefore economy should be much tougher in my view. People want FM to be a sim but in the same breath want an F1 car as soon as the game has loaded. I would rather we all start off in D class and earn our way up to open wheelers and I’d even like class lobbys only to become available once you reach that particular level. This “jump straight in” philosophy doesn’t make for a better game or community, instead it encourages poor racing and appeals to people who aren’t really interested. I used to love it when you had to complete a series to unlock a car to compete in the next event. There has to be something to aim for to make playing the game a rewarding experience.
Hey! That’s only my view and I’m not knocking anyone who wants all cars and events from the get go.
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